I love js. But the date object has always been a total pain. Moment.js is a good package to deal with it, but yeah, it’s currently deprecated, but it would be nice if it or something like it became part of ECMAScript.
I have no idea why it hasn’t yet, except that it might be that js needs to work for everyone, not just the us. So time is not standard.
The date API is like the original rip of the Java date API. Barely changed, and totally backwards compatible nonsense.
Temporal is the new JavaScript/ECMAScript date API.
It’s stage 3, and likely stable (just a few kinks being worked out). So you could polyfill it for production. https://github.com/tc39/proposal-temporal
It’s because there’s no right answer, and this way gets you the intuitive answer most often.
A month isn’t a proper unit of time. Adding a month to a date can’t be done without specifying which month you’re adding.
You could argue that one month from January 31 is February 28, 29 (depending on the year), March 2, or 3.
Should one month from the last day be the last day of the next month? That would mean that the 30th and the 31st of march are both the same duration from April 30th, and a month before April 30th could logically map to either one.
So they chose the path that, for anything other than the 31st, and the 29th and 30th if it comes near February, works as you expect. "A month after 17 days from the first of January is 17 days after the first of february.”
The other alternatives involve not allowing the addition and subtraction of irregular time intervals, but then you get frustrated that you can only deal with seconds, since those don’t change in length.
Having restrictions is far better than having random pitfalls that you fall into. An API works as you’d expect majority of the time and then has an edge case that’s entirely not obvious is a bad API. The whole problem with Js is that it’s full of rakes that you can step on. You can rationalize every one of these weird behaviors in Js, but that doesn’t make the language any easier to work with in practice. People forget a random rule here or there and then their code breaks in weird ways when the stars align just right. This is simply not how APIs should be designed.
I agree here. The convenience it may offer to developers who try it might be nice but the trade off is random craziness. I support not supporting features that are unintuitive. In this case that means not allowing someone to add “one month” to a date.
Exactly, it’s better to not have these sorts of “conveniences” than to create weird pitfalls. I find a lot of crazy Js behaviors are ultimately a result of Js trying to be accommodating of inputs that should just be straight up rejected.
So, the flip side to that is that sometimes you need to add one month to a date, because that sometimes how human systems are written.
By not providing a function that does that, you’re just pushing the confusion down to the developer, who is more likely to make terrible errors in the process, get frustrated, or use one of N different competing libraries, each of which chose a different answer.
Omitting functionality that can behave unintuitively in certain circumstances means leaving out a lot of functionality that people need.
Like, “decimal numbers” go pathological in certain cases. So do Unicode characters. Don’t even bother thinking about connecting to the network.
In Ruby (with ActiveSupport) I would do something like 4.days.from_now or 30.days.from_now.
If I really needed “one month from now” on some specific day of the month that not every month has I’d do:
def 31st_of_next_month
next_month = (Time.current.end_of_month + 1.day).beginning_of_month
day = next_month + 31.days
return day if day.month == next_month
# last day of month if no 31st
next_month.end_of_month.beginning_of_day
end
Disclaimer: I’m laying in bed typing this on mobile. The code probably sucks but I’m writing for illustrative purposes.
It seems really weird that there’s so much pushback against “date time math is tricky, read the manual to find out exactly which compromise your library chose”.
In this case though, it’s consistent, and is just one of the annoying ways the problem could be solved. Datetime math is just fucked up.
You can just not support that functionality, which gives you people making their own mistakes and forgetting leap years or hard coding all sorts of insanity.
You can clamp the value to the end of the month, but that gives you the odd case where date + month - month != date in some days, which is also a weird pitfall.
If I see any code dealing with adding and subtracting months, I’m either checking the manual or I already know it’s behavior from doing so before.
I’m all about not liking how JS does stuff, but Datetime math is the one area where in willing to forgive most insanity of outcomes.
One way to solve the problem is to give an error when you end up with an invalid input such as a data outside the range of valid dates for the month. The other way to solve the problem is to silently return nonsense which is what Js does. It’s just a matter of doing basic input validation.
Except it’s not nonsense. If you ask for 31 days after January 31st, you don’t get February 28th.
A month is a malformed concept to use in conjunction with arithmetic, except for the part where people do it all the time and just ignore the fact that it often gets weird.
Do you really think you’d be happier if the answer for "what’s a month from 01/31?” was “InvalidDateException”? That every other month the concept of “a month from today” is just undefined?
Saying “adding a month means adding the number of days in the starting month” is one choice of many, all of which have terrible downsides.
I’m arguing that every answer is wrong, and will return bizarre results, be aggravating, useless or some combination therein for some conditions.
Therefore you have to know the API, because every language will fuck you, and JavaScript isn’t special in this specific case.
Adding the number of days in the month to the date as “add one month” is just as rational as any other choice.
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date.setDate(1);Problem solved.
Sure, but the question is why anybody thought this would be a desirable behavior in the first place.
I love js. But the date object has always been a total pain. Moment.js is a good package to deal with it, but yeah, it’s currently deprecated, but it would be nice if it or something like it became part of ECMAScript.
I have no idea why it hasn’t yet, except that it might be that js needs to work for everyone, not just the us. So time is not standard.
The date API is like the original rip of the Java date API. Barely changed, and totally backwards compatible nonsense.
Temporal is the new JavaScript/ECMAScript date API.
It’s stage 3, and likely stable (just a few kinks being worked out). So you could polyfill it for production.
https://github.com/tc39/proposal-temporal
Speaking of Java RipS. How annoying is it the JS has left Java in the dust as far as looser standards?
Developing in Java: YOU FORGOT A SEMI-COLON ARE YOU CRAZY?! HOW IS THE COMPILER SUPPOSED TO KNOW WHAT TO DO?!
Developing in JS: Who gives a fuck about semi-colons?
You may be interested in the datefns library if you need a replacement for momentjs.
It’s because there’s no right answer, and this way gets you the intuitive answer most often.
A month isn’t a proper unit of time. Adding a month to a date can’t be done without specifying which month you’re adding.
You could argue that one month from January 31 is February 28, 29 (depending on the year), March 2, or 3.
Should one month from the last day be the last day of the next month? That would mean that the 30th and the 31st of march are both the same duration from April 30th, and a month before April 30th could logically map to either one.
So they chose the path that, for anything other than the 31st, and the 29th and 30th if it comes near February, works as you expect. "A month after 17 days from the first of January is 17 days after the first of february.”
The other alternatives involve not allowing the addition and subtraction of irregular time intervals, but then you get frustrated that you can only deal with seconds, since those don’t change in length.
Having restrictions is far better than having random pitfalls that you fall into. An API works as you’d expect majority of the time and then has an edge case that’s entirely not obvious is a bad API. The whole problem with Js is that it’s full of rakes that you can step on. You can rationalize every one of these weird behaviors in Js, but that doesn’t make the language any easier to work with in practice. People forget a random rule here or there and then their code breaks in weird ways when the stars align just right. This is simply not how APIs should be designed.
I agree here. The convenience it may offer to developers who try it might be nice but the trade off is random craziness. I support not supporting features that are unintuitive. In this case that means not allowing someone to add “one month” to a date.
Exactly, it’s better to not have these sorts of “conveniences” than to create weird pitfalls. I find a lot of crazy Js behaviors are ultimately a result of Js trying to be accommodating of inputs that should just be straight up rejected.
So, the flip side to that is that sometimes you need to add one month to a date, because that sometimes how human systems are written.
By not providing a function that does that, you’re just pushing the confusion down to the developer, who is more likely to make terrible errors in the process, get frustrated, or use one of N different competing libraries, each of which chose a different answer.
Omitting functionality that can behave unintuitively in certain circumstances means leaving out a lot of functionality that people need.
Like, “decimal numbers” go pathological in certain cases. So do Unicode characters. Don’t even bother thinking about connecting to the network.
In Ruby (with ActiveSupport) I would do something like
4.days.from_nowor30.days.from_now.If I really needed “one month from now” on some specific day of the month that not every month has I’d do:
Disclaimer: I’m laying in bed typing this on mobile. The code probably sucks but I’m writing for illustrative purposes.
Why wouldn’t you just use the ruby functions for adding a month to a date?
https://ruby-doc.org/stdlib-2.5.1/libdoc/date/rdoc/Date.html#method-i-3C-3C
It seems really weird that there’s so much pushback against “date time math is tricky, read the manual to find out exactly which compromise your library chose”.
In this case though, it’s consistent, and is just one of the annoying ways the problem could be solved. Datetime math is just fucked up.
You can just not support that functionality, which gives you people making their own mistakes and forgetting leap years or hard coding all sorts of insanity.
You can clamp the value to the end of the month, but that gives you the odd case where
date + month - month != datein some days, which is also a weird pitfall.If I see any code dealing with adding and subtracting months, I’m either checking the manual or I already know it’s behavior from doing so before.
I’m all about not liking how JS does stuff, but Datetime math is the one area where in willing to forgive most insanity of outcomes.
One way to solve the problem is to give an error when you end up with an invalid input such as a data outside the range of valid dates for the month. The other way to solve the problem is to silently return nonsense which is what Js does. It’s just a matter of doing basic input validation.
Except it’s not nonsense. If you ask for 31 days after January 31st, you don’t get February 28th.
A month is a malformed concept to use in conjunction with arithmetic, except for the part where people do it all the time and just ignore the fact that it often gets weird.
Do you really think you’d be happier if the answer for "what’s a month from 01/31?” was “InvalidDateException”? That every other month the concept of “a month from today” is just undefined?
Saying “adding a month means adding the number of days in the starting month” is one choice of many, all of which have terrible downsides.
Are you seriously arguing that this is the behavior a person using this API would intuitively expect?
What behavior do you expect? Specifically.
I’m arguing that every answer is wrong, and will return bizarre results, be aggravating, useless or some combination therein for some conditions.
Therefore you have to know the API, because every language will fuck you, and JavaScript isn’t special in this specific case.
Adding the number of days in the month to the date as “add one month” is just as rational as any other choice.