I don’t give a fuck about “splitting the Dem vote”. One reactionary mainstream party down is one reactionary mainstream party down. But yeah: this dweeb ain’t it. If shitty, counter-factual beliefs about vaccines weren’t enough, the political dynasty of his family should at least push people over the edge here.
Glad Cornel West is running, and hope he winds up with the Green nomination so he has a chance at decent ballot access. Unless the GP has an even better, more radical leftist in mind like Howie Hawkins again. He was the nominee of at least two leftist parties last time around, and I’d love to see those parties doing more of the same, like the “left unity slate” a couple of them did in California last year. Good stuff.
The Green Party hasn’t even succeeded in having a candidate elected to the U.S. House of Representatives — they show up for presidential elections, and that’s about it. They don’t do much work in the “off-season.” A vote for the presidential candidate of the Green Party at this point is a protest vote. The Republican Party is an existential threat to many groups of people; a protest vote in light of that threat is simply inaction in the face of having the privilege to not be targeted, and it only helps the oppressor.
The Green Party hasn’t even succeeded in having a candidate elected to the U.S. House of Representatives
And?
they show up for presidential elections, and that’s about it. They don’t do much work in the “off-season.”
Incorrect. The GP has run candidates in thousands of city, county, and state elections. Heck, in the last California state primaries they ran a “unity slate” with the Peace and Freedom party and had candidates for like 2/3 or 3/4 of the positions on my ballot.
A vote for the presidential candidate of the Green Party at this point is a protest vote.
Stupid, liberal phrasing. Don’t give a shit if this is what you call it, or how you’ve been told to think. The only wasted vote is one more voice for the continued monopoly of capital, and that’s obviously exactly what you do every single election.
Don’t give a shit if this is what you call it, or how you’ve been told to think. The only wasted vote is one more voice for the continued monopoly of capital, and that’s obviously exactly what you do every single election.
You’re prioritizing economic systems over people. That’s my problem with voting for third parties in light of fascism echoing the 1920s and 30s.
This is a pretty moronic statement. The choice of economic system is fundamental to if and how you prioritize people. The choice of capitalism is literally the choice to not prioritize people, but to prioritize property, and the interests of those who have power and will protect and hoard that property.
That’s my problem with voting for third parties in light of fascism echoing the 1920s and 30s.
You should honestly actually learn something about the rise of fascism in Nazi Germany and fascist Italy. For the love of all that is humane, read Fascism and Big Business by Daniel Guerin. YOU are buying into exactly that repeat of history you are using to fearmonger. Other, less reactionary liberals were absolutely instrumental to giving the fascist liberals power in both places, as they have proven over and over and over and over again that they will always do. There was—and is—absolutely no electoral or even legal solution to the problem of fascism. Literally the only thing that could have—and should have—stopped the fascists was organized labor and an organized left taking violent, direct action against them (Hitler and Goebbels both even admitted this explicitly).
While you are busy attacking the left—exactly as fascists do—and protecting those liberals who are literally upholding fascism (which is already here and has been for a long time), some of us are promoting the only thing that will save us from it: organizing, taking actual action, building liberation movements, and using liberal electoralism for the only good thing it can accomplish for the working class: getting people’s attention and broadcasting the messages that’ll get them to wake up, toss it in the bin, and move on to doing shit that’ll directly improve our lives.
Also, while you weren’t looking, you literally voted for a fascist in the last presidential election. Gotta love the promoting and subjugating oneself to Mussolini to save oneself from Hitler galaxy-brained liberal strategy of self-preservation.
Look, my take is that you are trying to combat fascism on philosophical terms, while I’m saying there is an even more pressing violence threatening people on a real level by taking steps that we know — at this moment in time — make it more likely to ending up with Republicans having power.
We don’t seem to be seeing things eye-to-eye, and you don’t seem to be able to hold this conversation without ad hominem attacks, so I’m going to check out.
Final note: I’m going to go back to my day, and forget about your condescension and nastiness because… well, I can. But if I see you talking this way to anyone else here (and I don’t just mean heated discussion), there will be consequences.
Have a nice day, and please be(e) respectful of everyone here.
Look, my take is that you are trying to combat fascism on philosophical terms
I mention direct action vs. you wanting to rely on electoralism and yet you claim I am the one “combating on philosophical terms”. Ironic.
more likely to ending up with Republicans having power.
This is why you have voted for fascists and will continue to do so. You believe they are constrained to a single party, and that the other liberals aren’t supporting them in nearly everything they do. Again, educate yourself. You referenced the 1930s, yet you clearly have not studied how fascism actually operated then. Or how it operates now.
We don’t seem to be seeing things eye-to-eye, and you don’t seem to be able to hold this conversation without ad hominem attacks, so I’m going to check out.
I see you don’t know what an ad hominem attack is. Everything I’ve said here is related to the content of your arguments. Criticism of your ignorance and ideology and how they manifest in your comments is not ad hominem. Pointing out how you support fascism by the agenda you are pushing and the very way you’ve implied you vote isn’t ad hominem. At least if you’re going to threaten people for calling you out, have some understanding of the accusations you are making of them first.
You’re right, that I haven’t been respectful in the sense of civility politics. But that started with you, shitting on anyone (including myself) who doesn’t vote for your favorite brand of the uni-party. My vote isn’t a “protest vote”, and yeah: fuck you for being disrespectful enough to call it that. Better start by banning yourself.
You were banned for 7 days for being unnecessarily confrontational and you come back and immediately pick another fight with a moderator? Why do you treat no one here with good faith? This isn’t a place to assume malicious negative intent. If you think the person is mislead speak your peace without insulting them, or even better try to educate them. If you can’t do either, this isn’t the space for you.
No? I continued an exchange where that mod had already replied to me. (Didn’t even realize they were a mod until they threatened me with “consequences” further on, by the way.)
Did you also miss the point that the mod was being just as insulting, from the start? I literally just pointed it out in the comment you replied to.
Did you miss where that moderator “assumed malicious negative intent” from me? Here, I’ll help:
You’re prioritizing economic systems over people.
Did you miss where I did, indeed, try to educate them? Let me help: every comment I’ve made. You might, in particular, like the part where I started with:
For the love of all that is humane, read Fascism and Big Business by Daniel Guerin. YOU are buying into exactly that repeat of history…
You banned me for 7 days (I guess—see below) for exactly the same kind of shit, and you’re really bad at judging these situations. But it’s good I have Big Brother admin stalking my comments to see if I follow the dictates of civility. Very cool.
EDIT: BTW, the only indication of being banned is that you can’t login; it just silently fails, as if there’s some kind of problem submitting the page. And then going to your own profile and seeing “banned” across the top. And no indication of whether it’s temporary or permanent, and no message from the system about why. Just FYI for when you do it again.
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I don’t give a fuck about “splitting the Dem vote”. One reactionary mainstream party down is one reactionary mainstream party down. But yeah: this dweeb ain’t it. If shitty, counter-factual beliefs about vaccines weren’t enough, the political dynasty of his family should at least push people over the edge here.
Glad Cornel West is running, and hope he winds up with the Green nomination so he has a chance at decent ballot access. Unless the GP has an even better, more radical leftist in mind like Howie Hawkins again. He was the nominee of at least two leftist parties last time around, and I’d love to see those parties doing more of the same, like the “left unity slate” a couple of them did in California last year. Good stuff.
The Green Party hasn’t even succeeded in having a candidate elected to the U.S. House of Representatives — they show up for presidential elections, and that’s about it. They don’t do much work in the “off-season.” A vote for the presidential candidate of the Green Party at this point is a protest vote. The Republican Party is an existential threat to many groups of people; a protest vote in light of that threat is simply inaction in the face of having the privilege to not be targeted, and it only helps the oppressor.
And?
Incorrect. The GP has run candidates in thousands of city, county, and state elections. Heck, in the last California state primaries they ran a “unity slate” with the Peace and Freedom party and had candidates for like 2/3 or 3/4 of the positions on my ballot.
Stupid, liberal phrasing. Don’t give a shit if this is what you call it, or how you’ve been told to think. The only wasted vote is one more voice for the continued monopoly of capital, and that’s obviously exactly what you do every single election.
You’re prioritizing economic systems over people. That’s my problem with voting for third parties in light of fascism echoing the 1920s and 30s.
This is a pretty moronic statement. The choice of economic system is fundamental to if and how you prioritize people. The choice of capitalism is literally the choice to not prioritize people, but to prioritize property, and the interests of those who have power and will protect and hoard that property.
You should honestly actually learn something about the rise of fascism in Nazi Germany and fascist Italy. For the love of all that is humane, read Fascism and Big Business by Daniel Guerin. YOU are buying into exactly that repeat of history you are using to fearmonger. Other, less reactionary liberals were absolutely instrumental to giving the fascist liberals power in both places, as they have proven over and over and over and over again that they will always do. There was—and is—absolutely no electoral or even legal solution to the problem of fascism. Literally the only thing that could have—and should have—stopped the fascists was organized labor and an organized left taking violent, direct action against them (Hitler and Goebbels both even admitted this explicitly).
While you are busy attacking the left—exactly as fascists do—and protecting those liberals who are literally upholding fascism (which is already here and has been for a long time), some of us are promoting the only thing that will save us from it: organizing, taking actual action, building liberation movements, and using liberal electoralism for the only good thing it can accomplish for the working class: getting people’s attention and broadcasting the messages that’ll get them to wake up, toss it in the bin, and move on to doing shit that’ll directly improve our lives.
Also, while you weren’t looking, you literally voted for a fascist in the last presidential election. Gotta love the promoting and subjugating oneself to Mussolini to save oneself from Hitler galaxy-brained liberal strategy of self-preservation.
Look, my take is that you are trying to combat fascism on philosophical terms, while I’m saying there is an even more pressing violence threatening people on a real level by taking steps that we know — at this moment in time — make it more likely to ending up with Republicans having power.
We don’t seem to be seeing things eye-to-eye, and you don’t seem to be able to hold this conversation without ad hominem attacks, so I’m going to check out.
Final note: I’m going to go back to my day, and forget about your condescension and nastiness because… well, I can. But if I see you talking this way to anyone else here (and I don’t just mean heated discussion), there will be consequences.
Have a nice day, and please be(e) respectful of everyone here.
I mention direct action vs. you wanting to rely on electoralism and yet you claim I am the one “combating on philosophical terms”. Ironic.
This is why you have voted for fascists and will continue to do so. You believe they are constrained to a single party, and that the other liberals aren’t supporting them in nearly everything they do. Again, educate yourself. You referenced the 1930s, yet you clearly have not studied how fascism actually operated then. Or how it operates now.
I see you don’t know what an ad hominem attack is. Everything I’ve said here is related to the content of your arguments. Criticism of your ignorance and ideology and how they manifest in your comments is not ad hominem. Pointing out how you support fascism by the agenda you are pushing and the very way you’ve implied you vote isn’t ad hominem. At least if you’re going to threaten people for calling you out, have some understanding of the accusations you are making of them first.
You’re right, that I haven’t been respectful in the sense of civility politics. But that started with you, shitting on anyone (including myself) who doesn’t vote for your favorite brand of the uni-party. My vote isn’t a “protest vote”, and yeah: fuck you for being disrespectful enough to call it that. Better start by banning yourself.
You were banned for 7 days for being unnecessarily confrontational and you come back and immediately pick another fight with a moderator? Why do you treat no one here with good faith? This isn’t a place to assume malicious negative intent. If you think the person is mislead speak your peace without insulting them, or even better try to educate them. If you can’t do either, this isn’t the space for you.
No? I continued an exchange where that mod had already replied to me. (Didn’t even realize they were a mod until they threatened me with “consequences” further on, by the way.)
Did you also miss the point that the mod was being just as insulting, from the start? I literally just pointed it out in the comment you replied to.
Did you miss where that moderator “assumed malicious negative intent” from me? Here, I’ll help:
Did you miss where I did, indeed, try to educate them? Let me help: every comment I’ve made. You might, in particular, like the part where I started with:
You banned me for 7 days (I guess—see below) for exactly the same kind of shit, and you’re really bad at judging these situations. But it’s good I have Big Brother admin stalking my comments to see if I follow the dictates of civility. Very cool.
EDIT: BTW, the only indication of being banned is that you can’t login; it just silently fails, as if there’s some kind of problem submitting the page. And then going to your own profile and seeing “banned” across the top. And no indication of whether it’s temporary or permanent, and no message from the system about why. Just FYI for when you do it again.