I’m an 8 year data center network engineer who recently broke 100k for the first time. When I got asked my salary requirements I actually only asked for 90k as my highest previous salary was 80k with lots of travel, then I found out they gave me 100k because it was the minimum they could pay someone in my position. I’ve read before about people making crazy salary increases (150%-300%) and am wondering if I played it incorrectly and how I could play it in the future. I plan to stay with my company for the next few years and upskilling heavily and am eyeing a promotion in my first year as I’ve already delivered big projects by contributing very early. I’ve progressed from call center/help desk/engineer etc (no degree, just certs) so my progression has been pretty linear, are people who are seeing massive jumps in pay just overselling their competency and failing forward? Or are there other fields in IT like programming/etc that are more likely to have higher progression scales?
$40K to $125K per year. I’m a self-taught web developer that worked all the shitty jobs for a long time; $40K was for a “small” company (that made bank)
Dang, I thought it was easier to break into programming. Did you have any formal education? I totally felt that, I had to climb through the ranks one painful step at a time.
I basically started learning HTML, CSS, JavaScript in my free time when I was like 10. I lived in the middle of nowhere and had tons of time. I eventually moved onto PHP then Ruby on Rails.
Because I didn’t have the proper experience/education, I was never seriously considered for any tech jobs. Basically I ended up building systems for places I worked at. One day while working in a warehouse the owner of another company we worked with offered me a job on the down low.
While working there I realized I could automate like 70% of my job and realized they were spending thousands of dollars on a system that hardly did anything.
I moved onto a small but highly profitable company but ended up leaving because the pay was terrible and my boss started cussing me out for stuff.
So finally last year I landed a web developer job at a “real” company, the one job still uses my web application to run their business and things are good. If only I could get more customers for my side business…
My last raise was 10k. But that was after 7+ years of no raises (agency work, slow times). When COVID hit, our business picked up for 2 years straight and I finally convinced them it was stable enough to commit. We’re a small company and they’d rather give out bonuses or assistance with personal expenses than commit to an annual salary increase (which I get), but COL has spiked in recent times, so the raise was well past due.
If I had the chance to follow my dreams, I would have been a paramedic, followed by either park ranger or some form of rescue team. Unfortunately, as a poor immigrant, I had to focus on pay, and paramedic pay was only about 2x minimum wage where I live, so I decided not to follow my dream. Thankfully I ended up in something else I enjoy. All that to say, you’re a hero in my book, and I’ve always thought paramedics should be paid significantly more.
I played a negotiation game of spending two weeks of research to explain to my company that I should be paid $165k, based on roles similar to me.
They said, “Well those are in expensive cities.” And I said, “They’re all remote jobs. And they’re all hiring.”
They came to the table with 155k, which was 30k more than a month prior. The scary part was a few months later, fucking Musk fired a bunch of Twitter people, and triggered the layoffs. So now I can’t do that negotiation again.
You can and you should. Musk’s layoffs and the ones that followed are a coordinated press campaign. The total impact on unfilled jobs for IT professional programmers was a tenth of one percent.
But according to the news cycles, without Musk’s microservices there’s plenty of us to go around now. /s
Yes. Companies are hiring slower right now because there’s less venture capital money sloshing around, but they’re accumulating company-ending-event technology debt while they do it.
Mark my words they will be desperate for your talents and paying accordingly soon. I predict another big hike in base pay as the game of chicken ends in a mad scramble. We will also see more companies paying long term consulting rates instead of staff rates for IT solutions.
Source: As a developer who hires developers, I’m watching this trainwreck from both sides of the track.
I don’t wait to be asked how much I am expecting to be paid. I generally ask the HR person what the salary range is for the role. You have 8 years experience so you can demand the top end of that pay scale.
I got just about 60% by switching the company.
Previously biggest bump that I got internally was about 30%, when I put an ultimatum on the table. Without the ultimatum I’d probably get like 10% max.
It’s always either switching the job or the threat of switching the hob that will make them pay.
Two years ago our software lead left. Me with 3 years experience was the most knowledgeable person on the team. He left because we had gotten acquired. 3 months later they gave me a raise from 92 to 103k, which I showed annoyance with. 6 months later the new company decided to throw money at the people they couldn’t afford to lose so I went to 128k. 6 months later I went to 143k
This is on a small team at a government contractor
TLDR: 51K (56%) in 1 year without switching companies
When I started at the company I currently work for, my then manager saw how hard I was working and negotiated an 11% raise on my behalf during my first annual review, and another 10% following. She was cool as hell and protected me from the upper management bullshit that was going on at the time. She left because they had her working 65+ hours every week for a CEO who was/is pissing away the company’s capital and goodwill with clients.
My current manager is the bullshit, I haven’t had a raise since my old manager left three years ago and I’ve been looking off and on for something else while I steadily lower my effort to be commensurate with my effective pay.
That was unexpected (at least to me), like idk it feels like Sweden a good place to stay. Yeah the American salaries can be crazy… but after you count everything… idk I don’t think I personally would have done it.
A good place to stay? I was renting a 2bd apt in Stockholm for 22000 SEK while making only 60k before taxes, after tax it was something like 38k. Yeah, sure, my kids daycare was subsidized and I didn’t have to worry about my health insurance, but what I was left with after taxes and rent was barely enough for us. Tbh I even was behind 1500 SEK copay on daycare a couple of times because of how little money I had. We had to eat mostly ätsnart items from ICA, I couldn’t afford to buy a bicycle, so I had to borrow one from a neighbor and fix it up, just to save some money on commuting because of expensive fares. The bicycle got stolen eventually.
After one year our landlord booted us even though I asked them in advance to renew the contract, a friend of mine told me that this is because I would be eligible for första hand rent contract after living there for 2 years, so landlords never renew 2nd hand rent contracts. We couldn’t find another place to live afterwards and had to rent an Airbnb for a while.
I moved to Cleveland OH afterwards. I make 2 times more now while paying only 1,600$ for a 3bd house. Our landlord is begging us to renew the contract. We can afford a car. We live normal life now.
Yeah I can see why it would be better. I expected better conditions on Sweden. That said still personally I would have probably tried somewhere else in Europe before America, that again that’s just me.
But overall, sweden has better safety nets if you lose your job. Healthcare that doesnt bankrupt you, education for your children that doesnt cost anything, etc
For a “working solo” dude i guess it matters less. But if you move your whole family…
I didn’t finish my degree so ended up going ops -> devops route.
Salary include estimated benefit values (ending salary)
12/hr -> 50k (60k) -> 70k (80k) -> 115k (125k) -> 115k (counter offered 185k upon resignation which I rejected) -> 190k -> 210k
There’s a lot more to the story but that might give an idea of possible bumps.
When I took a pay decrease from 125k -> 115k it was because the weekly cash was still slightly better but the benefits were far worse. I mostly took it because I needed to get to a cloud focused company to progress my career where I wanted it to go and my company at the time couldn’t get me any meaningful experience in cloud stuff at all. The pay jump after that really proved that the experience was worth it. I kind of wish I never joined the 190k company and instead took the counter offer. The 190k company I ended up really not liking leadership’s direction and handling of things.
Super happy now at 210k company where I am a bit of a manager. I really like the people, responsibilities, etc. Pay is pretty great, more than I need for sure, so paying extra on the house and good bucks in retirement for later. Of the higher paying places I’ve been at it is the only one I feel fulfilled and not constantly frustrated.
That’s great, can you elaborate what you mean by ops>devops? Do you support infrastructure or applications? I know devops is kind of a catch-all term now for automation, did you work on understanding cloud deployments from the POV of the servers/application or from infra?
I only ask because some of what I do is considered “devops” in the sense that I’m working on network automation, but a lot of times when I hear people discuss devops they’re talking about supporting applications
When I first started (hourly) I was doing basically field tech work at an msp. That means I was just a monkey following a document and would call for backup if I experienced any issues. I started getting some basic tasks to come up with newer processes, script some existing ones, and generally manage existing clients. I mostly got familiar with OS stuff, took a few Microsoft certs, that sort of stuff.
Second and third job I was doing more engineering of my own. I’d get higher level tasks like design an implementation of a next Gen firewall here, design next developer image, implement monitoring system, revamp backups, etc. Third job involved some public site management but I wasn’t yet too responsible for app deployments themselves though was often involved as escalation in app support.
Fourth job was more of the same but focused on automation this time. Our group was called ‘automation team’ and we revamped processes at a larger regional bank while adding automation. Before I left there we transitioned to DevOps team, but was more of a DevOps processes and platforms team. We wrote a lot of ci and automation but the goal was to have existing app support teams to own it. That model largely worked and we helped train the ops folks to be DevOps folks.
I moved to a cloud consulting company bc I wanted cloud experience and to get closer to app deployments. If you work on line of business applications then you’re more likely to demand higher pay while doing more interesting and important work. Managers usually need to improve the product so they’re less likely to be wanting to stick to the status quo.
The last two are similar, both justify architecture in the name. The previous though had a lot of bad practices, status quo managers, and was generally miserable. I’m currently quite a generalist because we’re at a small business. That said, main responsibilities include writing and supporting cicd pipeline, all infrastructure changes and automation, 3rd party mail system config, etc.
That’s great. That’s basically the route I’m looking to take, though my background is mostly with networking, so I have some catching up to do in sysadmin skills. Thanks for your insight! I’ll give you a follow (idk if that exists in the fediverse lol) and maybe follow up with you later. It’s great you’re willing to be a resource for the aspiring engineers. That’s the kind of spirit I try to embody.
No problem - I’ve had a couple unofficial mentors myself. In the tech world it’s also impossible to not be riding the shoulders of the giants before us.
The simple answer is, maybe. You could have had more if the competition wasn’t better. But you will never know if they were. My advice would be to focus on the fact that you just got a big raise, and enjoy the work. In a year, ask for more, say 10%, and if you’re good and fit the culture, they’ll do it. If not, start looking. Just be careful of jumping jobs too much.
I’ve been in leadership for a number of companies now. I’ve only had one manager actively tell me it was of no consequence to them. They retracted that after two good applicants, one with 6 jobs in 6 years was in the mix. Personal experience and gut, but it tells me you are in the minority.
41k -> 60k -> 70k -> 85k -> 100k -> 110k (2018-2023)
That 41 -> 60 felt huge.
60 -> 70 felt like a drop, it was a job change and I lost overtime and we were paid every 2 weeks instead of twice a month. (26 paychecks instead of 24)
These days, what makes all the difference are the bonus programs. My income is generally 25% higher than my base through company stock programs, bonuses and high performance grants.
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I’m fresh out of grad school, and the shift from 22k to 60k has been life changing
$40K to $125K per year. I’m a self-taught web developer that worked all the shitty jobs for a long time; $40K was for a “small” company (that made bank)
Dang, I thought it was easier to break into programming. Did you have any formal education? I totally felt that, I had to climb through the ranks one painful step at a time.
I basically started learning HTML, CSS, JavaScript in my free time when I was like 10. I lived in the middle of nowhere and had tons of time. I eventually moved onto PHP then Ruby on Rails.
Because I didn’t have the proper experience/education, I was never seriously considered for any tech jobs. Basically I ended up building systems for places I worked at. One day while working in a warehouse the owner of another company we worked with offered me a job on the down low.
While working there I realized I could automate like 70% of my job and realized they were spending thousands of dollars on a system that hardly did anything.
I moved onto a small but highly profitable company but ended up leaving because the pay was terrible and my boss started cussing me out for stuff.
So finally last year I landed a web developer job at a “real” company, the one job still uses my web application to run their business and things are good. If only I could get more customers for my side business…
My last raise was 10k. But that was after 7+ years of no raises (agency work, slow times). When COVID hit, our business picked up for 2 years straight and I finally convinced them it was stable enough to commit. We’re a small company and they’d rather give out bonuses or assistance with personal expenses than commit to an annual salary increase (which I get), but COL has spiked in recent times, so the raise was well past due.
Last Spring all the Paramedics & EMTs got an hourly increase. I was expecting maybe $1.00-1.50… very shocked with a $6.30hr raise!
If I had the chance to follow my dreams, I would have been a paramedic, followed by either park ranger or some form of rescue team. Unfortunately, as a poor immigrant, I had to focus on pay, and paramedic pay was only about 2x minimum wage where I live, so I decided not to follow my dream. Thankfully I ended up in something else I enjoy. All that to say, you’re a hero in my book, and I’ve always thought paramedics should be paid significantly more.
Ty
Over the last 5 years I have went from 50k to 90k. Same company, but recently got promoted to a new department.
I played a negotiation game of spending two weeks of research to explain to my company that I should be paid $165k, based on roles similar to me.
They said, “Well those are in expensive cities.” And I said, “They’re all remote jobs. And they’re all hiring.”
They came to the table with 155k, which was 30k more than a month prior. The scary part was a few months later, fucking Musk fired a bunch of Twitter people, and triggered the layoffs. So now I can’t do that negotiation again.
You can and you should. Musk’s layoffs and the ones that followed are a coordinated press campaign. The total impact on unfilled jobs for IT professional programmers was a tenth of one percent.
But according to the news cycles, without Musk’s microservices there’s plenty of us to go around now. /s
Yes. Companies are hiring slower right now because there’s less venture capital money sloshing around, but they’re accumulating company-ending-event technology debt while they do it.
Mark my words they will be desperate for your talents and paying accordingly soon. I predict another big hike in base pay as the game of chicken ends in a mad scramble. We will also see more companies paying long term consulting rates instead of staff rates for IT solutions.
Source: As a developer who hires developers, I’m watching this trainwreck from both sides of the track.
Gottem.
I don’t wait to be asked how much I am expecting to be paid. I generally ask the HR person what the salary range is for the role. You have 8 years experience so you can demand the top end of that pay scale.
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT86J7mpN/ This is basically a shot for shot remake of how the meeting went down
I got just about 60% by switching the company. Previously biggest bump that I got internally was about 30%, when I put an ultimatum on the table. Without the ultimatum I’d probably get like 10% max. It’s always either switching the job or the threat of switching the hob that will make them pay.
Two years ago our software lead left. Me with 3 years experience was the most knowledgeable person on the team. He left because we had gotten acquired. 3 months later they gave me a raise from 92 to 103k, which I showed annoyance with. 6 months later the new company decided to throw money at the people they couldn’t afford to lose so I went to 128k. 6 months later I went to 143k
This is on a small team at a government contractor
TLDR: 51K (56%) in 1 year without switching companies
When I started at the company I currently work for, my then manager saw how hard I was working and negotiated an 11% raise on my behalf during my first annual review, and another 10% following. She was cool as hell and protected me from the upper management bullshit that was going on at the time. She left because they had her working 65+ hours every week for a CEO who was/is pissing away the company’s capital and goodwill with clients.
My current manager is the bullshit, I haven’t had a raise since my old manager left three years ago and I’ve been looking off and on for something else while I steadily lower my effort to be commensurate with my effective pay.
You can find her online. Maybe she can hire you at her new job
200% increase once I moved to the U. S from Sweden. I’m so happy to finally leave Europe
That was unexpected (at least to me), like idk it feels like Sweden a good place to stay. Yeah the American salaries can be crazy… but after you count everything… idk I don’t think I personally would have done it.
A good place to stay? I was renting a 2bd apt in Stockholm for 22000 SEK while making only 60k before taxes, after tax it was something like 38k. Yeah, sure, my kids daycare was subsidized and I didn’t have to worry about my health insurance, but what I was left with after taxes and rent was barely enough for us. Tbh I even was behind 1500 SEK copay on daycare a couple of times because of how little money I had. We had to eat mostly ätsnart items from ICA, I couldn’t afford to buy a bicycle, so I had to borrow one from a neighbor and fix it up, just to save some money on commuting because of expensive fares. The bicycle got stolen eventually. After one year our landlord booted us even though I asked them in advance to renew the contract, a friend of mine told me that this is because I would be eligible for första hand rent contract after living there for 2 years, so landlords never renew 2nd hand rent contracts. We couldn’t find another place to live afterwards and had to rent an Airbnb for a while. I moved to Cleveland OH afterwards. I make 2 times more now while paying only 1,600$ for a 3bd house. Our landlord is begging us to renew the contract. We can afford a car. We live normal life now.
Yeah I can see why it would be better. I expected better conditions on Sweden. That said still personally I would have probably tried somewhere else in Europe before America, that again that’s just me.
Good pay, probably
But overall, sweden has better safety nets if you lose your job. Healthcare that doesnt bankrupt you, education for your children that doesnt cost anything, etc
For a “working solo” dude i guess it matters less. But if you move your whole family…
I didn’t finish my degree so ended up going ops -> devops route.
Salary include estimated benefit values (ending salary) 12/hr -> 50k (60k) -> 70k (80k) -> 115k (125k) -> 115k (counter offered 185k upon resignation which I rejected) -> 190k -> 210k
There’s a lot more to the story but that might give an idea of possible bumps.
When I took a pay decrease from 125k -> 115k it was because the weekly cash was still slightly better but the benefits were far worse. I mostly took it because I needed to get to a cloud focused company to progress my career where I wanted it to go and my company at the time couldn’t get me any meaningful experience in cloud stuff at all. The pay jump after that really proved that the experience was worth it. I kind of wish I never joined the 190k company and instead took the counter offer. The 190k company I ended up really not liking leadership’s direction and handling of things.
Super happy now at 210k company where I am a bit of a manager. I really like the people, responsibilities, etc. Pay is pretty great, more than I need for sure, so paying extra on the house and good bucks in retirement for later. Of the higher paying places I’ve been at it is the only one I feel fulfilled and not constantly frustrated.
That’s great, can you elaborate what you mean by ops>devops? Do you support infrastructure or applications? I know devops is kind of a catch-all term now for automation, did you work on understanding cloud deployments from the POV of the servers/application or from infra?
I only ask because some of what I do is considered “devops” in the sense that I’m working on network automation, but a lot of times when I hear people discuss devops they’re talking about supporting applications
Yeah, happy to elaborate!
When I first started (hourly) I was doing basically field tech work at an msp. That means I was just a monkey following a document and would call for backup if I experienced any issues. I started getting some basic tasks to come up with newer processes, script some existing ones, and generally manage existing clients. I mostly got familiar with OS stuff, took a few Microsoft certs, that sort of stuff.
Second and third job I was doing more engineering of my own. I’d get higher level tasks like design an implementation of a next Gen firewall here, design next developer image, implement monitoring system, revamp backups, etc. Third job involved some public site management but I wasn’t yet too responsible for app deployments themselves though was often involved as escalation in app support.
Fourth job was more of the same but focused on automation this time. Our group was called ‘automation team’ and we revamped processes at a larger regional bank while adding automation. Before I left there we transitioned to DevOps team, but was more of a DevOps processes and platforms team. We wrote a lot of ci and automation but the goal was to have existing app support teams to own it. That model largely worked and we helped train the ops folks to be DevOps folks.
I moved to a cloud consulting company bc I wanted cloud experience and to get closer to app deployments. If you work on line of business applications then you’re more likely to demand higher pay while doing more interesting and important work. Managers usually need to improve the product so they’re less likely to be wanting to stick to the status quo.
The last two are similar, both justify architecture in the name. The previous though had a lot of bad practices, status quo managers, and was generally miserable. I’m currently quite a generalist because we’re at a small business. That said, main responsibilities include writing and supporting cicd pipeline, all infrastructure changes and automation, 3rd party mail system config, etc.
If you have any more questions lmk.
That’s great. That’s basically the route I’m looking to take, though my background is mostly with networking, so I have some catching up to do in sysadmin skills. Thanks for your insight! I’ll give you a follow (idk if that exists in the fediverse lol) and maybe follow up with you later. It’s great you’re willing to be a resource for the aspiring engineers. That’s the kind of spirit I try to embody.
No problem - I’ve had a couple unofficial mentors myself. In the tech world it’s also impossible to not be riding the shoulders of the giants before us.
I got a 35% salary increase when I started a new job a few months ago. I was very excited.
The simple answer is, maybe. You could have had more if the competition wasn’t better. But you will never know if they were. My advice would be to focus on the fact that you just got a big raise, and enjoy the work. In a year, ask for more, say 10%, and if you’re good and fit the culture, they’ll do it. If not, start looking. Just be careful of jumping jobs too much.
I hear this a lot, but as a hiring manager, jumping jobs every year or so isn’t a red flag, to me.
I’ve been in leadership for a number of companies now. I’ve only had one manager actively tell me it was of no consequence to them. They retracted that after two good applicants, one with 6 jobs in 6 years was in the mix. Personal experience and gut, but it tells me you are in the minority.
I appreciate the advice. I’m certainly happy with the raise, just trying to think ahead
Enjoy your time and good luck!
41k -> 60k -> 70k -> 85k -> 100k -> 110k (2018-2023) That 41 -> 60 felt huge. 60 -> 70 felt like a drop, it was a job change and I lost overtime and we were paid every 2 weeks instead of twice a month. (26 paychecks instead of 24)
These days, what makes all the difference are the bonus programs. My income is generally 25% higher than my base through company stock programs, bonuses and high performance grants.