mastodon.art has decided to suspend firefish.social from their instance due to issues with its administrator. The administrator of firefish.social was found to be boosting posts from a known harasser on another instance. mastodon.art takes a firm stance against racism and suspending full instances in these situations is part of their policy as a safe space. The known harasser has a history of using slurs, harassment, and editing screenshots to spread misinformation. However, the administrator of firefish.social has now forged a screenshot to paint mastodon.art in a negative light.
But what happens (as did recently) when instances change direction? What happens (as did last year) where one instance admin had the wrong contact details for another so a message didn’t get through and ended up with an instance blocked and defederated for no good reason. What happens when an admin has an episode and gets in an argument that results in tit for tat blocks.
How can any new user know this might happen? How can they know what they are signing up for when descriptions are so brief?
Defederation is a good thing but unfortunately the people are human and fallible.
You can always set up your own instance if you are disturbed by the actions of admins on instances that you have joined.
Alternatively, if the instance you are on changes direction, you can easily find a new one. It literally took me about half an hour after I learned about the Fediverse to get myself set up on several instances, then later on I decided which I preferred. But I didn’t delete the other accounts- they’re still there in case I want them someday.
But what happens if the instance you are on is defederated through no fault of your own. As has already happened, even not through the fault of the instance admin but another instance making a mistake and adding it to a block list.
There isn’t an easy way to migrate everything to a new instance. And the migration options we do have a a bit buggy.
Perhaps people have seen the survey of ex-mastodon users? It really brings out that federation is simultaneously an advantage and a problem.
At the moment, it looks like the only solution is to have multiple accounts and when you do it’s starkly evident that there’s content that you miss because of federation issues
I think the issue is that your are expecting a perfectly seamless, Reddit-like experience, with all the admin work done for you but also always done to your satisfaction. That isn’t what the Fediverse is about. It’s more of a DIY ethic than a “The admins suck but this is all we have” like on Reddit.
I’m also not sure what you’d need to “migrate” to a new instance other than yourself. Karma isn’t super relevant here.
My main account is on Beehaw, which has very rightfully defederated with some other instances. When I log in using accounts on other instances, I don’t see a massive amount of missed content. In fact I’ve seen so little of interest that I’ve stopped looking, it’s not worth my time.
I don’t recognise that expectation. I simply expected to be able to join and interact with friends/online acquaintances without someone else’s decision about something I have no control cutting us off.
As for migration, in most cases you can’t yet migrate your post history and migrating your followers/following list is hit and miss.
These are practical issues that need sorting if the fediverse is to succeed and last. Otherwise people will end up back on managed services like Bsky, threads and Reddit.
Have you seen the jokey post going around. This is what it feels like in the fediverse.
“Hey, can you switch instances? Your admin favorited a joke that I didn’t appreciate once. Might need to block you otherwise. Oh, and that crowdfunding platform you use? Back in 2006 they let an organization I don’t personally align with use their platform. You should abandon that. Also, -”
The jokey post is true. The difference is whether a user sees this as a bug or a feature. Many of us see it as a feature. If you see it as a bug, maybe Lemmy isn’t for you.
I also don’t want to see the Fediverse “succeed”. Both Reddit and Facebook were great for a while, then they “succeeded” and enshittification began. The Fediverse is fine how it is, it doesn’t need to become the most popular thing on the internet in order to keep my interest.
Succeed doesn’t mean to become the greatest, it means to establish itself and survive.
In my opinion the feature you talk about will ultimately end up with small groups or single user instances shouting into the void as hardly anyone is federated with anyone else.
You are not logged in. However you can subscribe from another Fediverse account, for example Lemmy or Mastodon. To do this, paste the following into the search field of your instance: !technology@beehaw.org
A nice place to discuss rumors, happenings, innovations, and challenges in the technology sphere. We also welcome discussions on the intersections of technology and society. If it’s technological news or discussion of technology, it probably belongs here.
Remember the overriding ethos on Beehaw: Be(e) Nice. Each user you encounter here is a person, and should be treated with kindness (even if they’re wrong, or use a Linux distro you don’t like). Personal attacks will not be tolerated.
But what happens (as did recently) when instances change direction? What happens (as did last year) where one instance admin had the wrong contact details for another so a message didn’t get through and ended up with an instance blocked and defederated for no good reason. What happens when an admin has an episode and gets in an argument that results in tit for tat blocks.
How can any new user know this might happen? How can they know what they are signing up for when descriptions are so brief?
Defederation is a good thing but unfortunately the people are human and fallible.
You can always set up your own instance if you are disturbed by the actions of admins on instances that you have joined.
Alternatively, if the instance you are on changes direction, you can easily find a new one. It literally took me about half an hour after I learned about the Fediverse to get myself set up on several instances, then later on I decided which I preferred. But I didn’t delete the other accounts- they’re still there in case I want them someday.
But what happens if the instance you are on is defederated through no fault of your own. As has already happened, even not through the fault of the instance admin but another instance making a mistake and adding it to a block list.
There isn’t an easy way to migrate everything to a new instance. And the migration options we do have a a bit buggy.
Perhaps people have seen the survey of ex-mastodon users? It really brings out that federation is simultaneously an advantage and a problem.
At the moment, it looks like the only solution is to have multiple accounts and when you do it’s starkly evident that there’s content that you miss because of federation issues
I think the issue is that your are expecting a perfectly seamless, Reddit-like experience, with all the admin work done for you but also always done to your satisfaction. That isn’t what the Fediverse is about. It’s more of a DIY ethic than a “The admins suck but this is all we have” like on Reddit.
I’m also not sure what you’d need to “migrate” to a new instance other than yourself. Karma isn’t super relevant here.
My main account is on Beehaw, which has very rightfully defederated with some other instances. When I log in using accounts on other instances, I don’t see a massive amount of missed content. In fact I’ve seen so little of interest that I’ve stopped looking, it’s not worth my time.
I don’t recognise that expectation. I simply expected to be able to join and interact with friends/online acquaintances without someone else’s decision about something I have no control cutting us off.
As for migration, in most cases you can’t yet migrate your post history and migrating your followers/following list is hit and miss.
These are practical issues that need sorting if the fediverse is to succeed and last. Otherwise people will end up back on managed services like Bsky, threads and Reddit.
Have you seen the jokey post going around. This is what it feels like in the fediverse.
“Hey, can you switch instances? Your admin favorited a joke that I didn’t appreciate once. Might need to block you otherwise. Oh, and that crowdfunding platform you use? Back in 2006 they let an organization I don’t personally align with use their platform. You should abandon that. Also, -”
The jokey post is true. The difference is whether a user sees this as a bug or a feature. Many of us see it as a feature. If you see it as a bug, maybe Lemmy isn’t for you.
I also don’t want to see the Fediverse “succeed”. Both Reddit and Facebook were great for a while, then they “succeeded” and enshittification began. The Fediverse is fine how it is, it doesn’t need to become the most popular thing on the internet in order to keep my interest.
Succeed doesn’t mean to become the greatest, it means to establish itself and survive.
In my opinion the feature you talk about will ultimately end up with small groups or single user instances shouting into the void as hardly anyone is federated with anyone else.