Isn’t that what sca- uhh, I mean super legit game devs normally do? Suddenly the scope was neeeever that big! You just think you remember all’ those claims that are still visible! No one actually said things you can prove they did!
I feel like this has happened numerous times already and somehow it surprises people every time. Like, there are channels on YouTube that only cover this sort of thing and have days of content.
No, you are saying that you are entitled to an developers code if they leave a project just because they let you test it. You are acting/being entitled as fuck.
Engywuck ( @Engywuck@lemm.ee ) True… It amazes me when people become so entitled online, especially in the FOSS community. It looks like they think devs owe them something.
jarfil ( @jarfil@beehaw.org ) They got free testing for the promise of releasing the source, then failed to fulfill that promise, so… yeah, they do owe those people something.
@Scary_le_Poo and @jarfil: if the two of you have a disagreement on another thread, please work it out between the two of you like adults there; don’t spill it over into other, unrelated threads.
@Scary_le_Poo, these types of personal attacks are not acceptable on beehaw. It is possible to disagree while still being kind and without resorting to angry or abusive language. Please try to remember beehaw’s guiding principal when interacting with others in the future.
So I just ran across this, after leaving a comment in that same thread. Posting it again here to try and add some sanity back to this discussion:
Okay, but there’s a line here somewhere. Pushing for new features and complaining in the issue tracker that a bug hasn’t been fixed soon enough is absolutely entitlement. Expecting someone to follow through on their word and release the source code is another thing entirely. Especially if they make the decision to stop working on it.
Go check out this EoL statement from the developer of Nomie. He open-sourced the code without even being asked too.
As far as I know the developer never actually said he would release the source. That is purely hearsay from @jarfil. He seems to think that if an app or program is free then it also must follow that it’s open source.
You are saying that getting people to do work for you by promising them something in return, means nothing, that you can break that promise whenever you want.
No, I’m a foss dev, and I speak for all of us when I ask you to please not join any of our communities.
Also I’m calling you out. You need to put up or shut up evidence of where that developer said that he would release his code as open source. And that he would do it in return for you testing it.
The promise I’m referring to, is to “release the code”.
(long version)
I understand the thought process of people not wanting to show how messy their pre-production code is… but that’s why, following semver rules, you mark it as a version “0.x.y”. It’s not an exam, it’s nothing to be ashamed of, anyone who’s written code knows that’s how things work, and it’s on the community to be understanding of this, so the “initial dev” of an open source project should feel confident in releasing a tangled mess, no less no more.
Promising the code, then disappearing without giving a community that’s invested in the project a chance to take over, is what I find fishy.
I’ve nothing to say more on topic. Off topic, people may be quite different and even if objectively there should be nothing bad in releasing pre-production, they may find it sensitive + there might be someone to actively offend for that. I only encountered the former, luckily
I saw that announcement video when it first came out and was super hyped for The Division. I didn’t end up playing it until around 2019 and I was really impressed with how close to the trailer the actual gameplay was. I know it had some controversy, but I guess I’m easy to impress lol
Ah, that’s fair. I’m a pretty casual player and didn’t really go deep beyond the medium skill levels, so I didn’t really appreciate the cut-corners beyond that. I hardly even played much multiplayer TBH, I played and loved the single-player campaigns, which is what I tend to do on most games :D
Like CDPR changing Cyberpunk from RPG to Action-adventure. At least the game didn’t release at that point though, but still. I mean Destiny even gets called an MMO when it isn’t. Genre is kind of misused a lot, people just need to stop buying or getting invested in games that haven’t even released.
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Isn’t that what sca- uhh, I mean super legit game devs normally do? Suddenly the scope was neeeever that big! You just think you remember all’ those claims that are still visible! No one actually said things you can prove they did!
I feel like this has happened numerous times already and somehow it surprises people every time. Like, there are channels on YouTube that only cover this sort of thing and have days of content.
According to a recent discussion in another thread, I’ve been told that expecting devs to honor their word, is “entitlement”…
No, you are saying that you are entitled to an developers code if they leave a project just because they let you test it. You are acting/being entitled as fuck.
Yeah, that’s not how any of this works.
@Scary_le_Poo and @jarfil: if the two of you have a disagreement on another thread, please work it out between the two of you like adults there; don’t spill it over into other, unrelated threads.
@Scary_le_Poo, these types of personal attacks are not acceptable on beehaw. It is possible to disagree while still being kind and without resorting to angry or abusive language. Please try to remember beehaw’s guiding principal when interacting with others in the future.
We didn’t have any interaction in the other thread, I only mentioned it because I saw a similarity between the topics. Guess I struck a nerve.
How is me calling him entitled as fuck a personal attack? Would you rather I said “you are being/acting entitled as fuck”? I can do that…
So I just ran across this, after leaving a comment in that same thread. Posting it again here to try and add some sanity back to this discussion:
As far as I know the developer never actually said he would release the source. That is purely hearsay from @jarfil. He seems to think that if an app or program is free then it also must follow that it’s open source.
You’re putting words in their mouth. Also, as far as I know, the developer is a woman.
No, I am not. He previously stated exactly what I said. I did not straw man him.
You are saying that getting people to do work for you by promising them something in return, means nothing, that you can break that promise whenever you want.
That’s what a scammer would say.
No, I’m a foss dev, and I speak for all of us when I ask you to please not join any of our communities.
Also I’m calling you out. You need to put up or shut up evidence of where that developer said that he would release his code as open source. And that he would do it in return for you testing it.
Sure, I’ll write your name down in the black book. What’s your GitHub nick, or wherever you keep your stuff?
From the article:
https://wedistribute.org/2023/12/artemis-shuts-down/
Implying the code was supposed to get released. You may want to ask the article’s author about where they got that out.
I’m mostly with you but “didn’t want to release prematurely” is not a promise, as you can never know when one sees code as matured.
The promise I’m referring to, is to “release the code”.
(long version)
I understand the thought process of people not wanting to show how messy their pre-production code is… but that’s why, following semver rules, you mark it as a version “0.x.y”. It’s not an exam, it’s nothing to be ashamed of, anyone who’s written code knows that’s how things work, and it’s on the community to be understanding of this, so the “initial dev” of an open source project should feel confident in releasing a tangled mess, no less no more.
Promising the code, then disappearing without giving a community that’s invested in the project a chance to take over, is what I find fishy.
I’ve nothing to say more on topic. Off topic, people may be quite different and even if objectively there should be nothing bad in releasing pre-production, they may find it sensitive + there might be someone to actively offend for that. I only encountered the former, luckily
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I saw that announcement video when it first came out and was super hyped for The Division. I didn’t end up playing it until around 2019 and I was really impressed with how close to the trailer the actual gameplay was. I know it had some controversy, but I guess I’m easy to impress lol
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Ah, that’s fair. I’m a pretty casual player and didn’t really go deep beyond the medium skill levels, so I didn’t really appreciate the cut-corners beyond that. I hardly even played much multiplayer TBH, I played and loved the single-player campaigns, which is what I tend to do on most games :D
Like CDPR changing Cyberpunk from RPG to Action-adventure. At least the game didn’t release at that point though, but still. I mean Destiny even gets called an MMO when it isn’t. Genre is kind of misused a lot, people just need to stop buying or getting invested in games that haven’t even released.