Canada has been left out of a recent expansion of Google's artificial intelligence-powered chatbot known as Bard as the big tech giant continues its fight with the federal government over the Online News Act.
Canada has been left out of a recent expansion of Google’s artificial intelligence-powered chatbot known as Bard as the big tech giant continues its fight with the federal government over the Online News Act.
Canada has long been excluded from a lot of newly releases products from a lot of American companies.
Most of the time it’s like they simply forget we exist. Or they don’t want to comply with our stronger consumer protection regulations, or labelling laws or anything else.
Even though this may be part of their whining about the latest law, it could also just be part of that long pattern.
Google “do no evil” my ass. Lately I’ve become very tired of all these tech companies who think they control the internet. That’s not how internet works. I think they forgot how it really works.
And this AI shit? It’s kind of disappointing. And the reason for that is because of how corporations are trying to exploit it to maximise their profits just like everything/everybody else.
Technology in general, including AI, was supposed to make our lives easier. Make us need to work less to produce just as much or more. The goal was to have a utopia where nobody would have to work anymore and technology would take care of everything for us. But NOOOOOOO. We’re still working harder than ever just trying to get by, and if we can be replace by technology, then too fucking bad. You end up poor, homeless and you’re told by the same wealthy people who fired you and who are benefiting from technology to “pick yourself up by your bootstraps”.
Don’t care. Google is also being a baby and blocking Canadians from Canadian news.
Perhaps we should all move away from Google? They clearly can’t be trusted when their response to pay Canadian journalists for rehosting their content is “nah, we instead are going to block Canadian news”.
I don’t think it’s unfair to pay someone when you’re rehosting their stuff or driving away clicks by giving an article summary. Especially when there’s no Google without links. Just like Reddit doesn’t work without users submitting content. Not to mention it’s bold to play this game when there are plenty of Google alternatives now.
I switched to duck duck go a year ago and honestly I get my news quicker and more reliably from Lemmy, TikTok, and previously Reddit.
It’s actually scary how much I see from 50 different angles on TikTok before any news outlet even covers it, if even. Saw a stabbing in Toronto from multiple angles a few HOURS before I even seen an article about it.
I know Lemmy hates TikTok, but can’t deny it’s great for being up to date ASAP when it comes to news. At least for right now.
DDG which uses Bing to power its results will also have to comply by the same law or drop Canadian news results if they don’t want to negotiate and pay.
The official list of digital news intermediaries hasn’t yet been published by the CRTC. Although Alphabet and Meta have been in the news, it’s very likely Microsoft will also be impacted and by proxy all services that use Bing (including Yahoo and DDG).
Why wouldn’t they? Microsoft operates the largest search engine used in Canada after Google, owns LinkedIn which is one of the top 10 social media platforms with a heavy news aggregation focus like Facebook, provides a default news aggregation feed pre-installed on all Windows computers, etc.
By the wording of the bill, there’s no reason they can’t be labeled as having a “prominent market position” or “a strategic advantage over news businesses”. And this applies especially so if Alphabet and Meta recuse themselves from the Canadian news market.
If the spirit of the bill is to get money from big corporations to support Canadian news organizations, then there’s no reason not to target Microsoft. And the fact that MS has already been consulted on the bill and released a statement about it strongly suggests they’ll be on the list.
The bill itself doesn’t name any specific company. It has a clause saying that the CRTC will publish and maintain a list of “digital news intermediaries” to which the contents of the bill apply. The official list isn’t yet available.
“Reposting” as in linking to their content? Most other companies pay Google for that service.
How are those companies going to drive views to their site? Do you think Microsoft and Meta are going to play ball? They aren’t. Do you expect Lemmy instances to pay whenever someone uploads a Canadian news article?
Our country is a literal South Park meme right now. We’re just waiting on the bubble gum and Bennigans coupons.
This is borderline fascist legislation. Restricting the flow of information on the internet so that Canadians are forced to turn to traditional mainstream media for their news. It was never about money.
“Reposting” as in linking to their content? Most other companies pay Google for that service.
Google has apps that rehost content instead of linking to it. Also, many people only view the headline or the brief description, driving views away completely.
How are those companies going to drive views to their site? Do you think Microsoft and Meta are going to play ball? They aren’t. Do you expect Lemmy instances to pay whenever someone uploads a Canadian news article?
Like I said, search engines rely on content to work. You can already request your website be removed from Google, and prevent it from ever being crawled again. Imagine if everyone did this, Google would literally be useless. Google needs content to work. Google shows ads in their search engine, so they are getting paid by simply linking to your website.
Who said Meta and Microsoft wont play ball? Who said Lemmy is going to have to, is Lemmy a search engine? You’re losing the point.
Our country is a literal South Park meme right now. We’re just waiting on the bubble gum and Bennigans coupons.
Ya, because people like you are okay with Google censoring and blocking news to Canadians for… some reason? Not sure why.
This is borderline fascist legislation. Restricting the flow of information on the internet so that Canadians are forced to turn to traditional mainstream media for their news. It was never about money.
Oh, there’s the south park coming out. It’s clear you’ve never created content online. What Google is doing is wrong, and Canadian journalists aren’t wrong for wanting to be paid for views that are taken away. It’s quite literally Google that is restricting the flow of information, so not sure why you’re blaming Canada.
All Google needs to do is pay pennies per click, just like they do with everything else. They are being a greedy American company who will slowly learn that they can’t treat the rest of the world like they do Americans. Look how great Google is. https://youtu.be/cA_cJAFF8Ss
As someone who has had to actively contact an AI company and expressly deny use of digital images on our website, I’m confident there are no boundaries with what they scrape from the Internet. They don’t have any respect and slurp up everything in their path, which unfortunately leads to only one possible outcome - a culturally desensitised dataset. It will become the ‘neutral average’ of the internet, banal in many ways and biased in others. Don’t expect anything that resembles Canadian sentiment to come out of any non-Canadian AI (Same problem but different locale for me - UK/Eire).
Any that’s before it starts eating it’s own tail - there’s pictures of generative images where they fed data back in, and it’s as interesting as it is amusing and horrific. Keeping the data clean is an unsolved problem because it’s hard to differentiate organic and synthetic sources.
All of this pales into insignificance with (as far as I know) all AI lacking the ability to admit when it doesn’t know. It just makes it up from nothing.
I have access to ChatGPT, Bard, etc. I haven’t found a use for any of it yet (software engineering) where I trust it enough and the experiments I’ve run have proved this, for me personally. It’s a novelty, a toy, it will evolve. As for the Online News Act, I’m conflicted. I believe in a free and open Internet, which goes against both restrictive legislation and against the likes of Google and Meta who abuse their position in the online landscape. My instinct is I’d rather have the Online News Act than Bard as the publisher should own their content, so good luck with that.
This! I see the hype around AI and it’s like everyone has lost their mind. You wouldn’t accept a statistical study without sampling info (dataset size, origin, selection, filtering, bias, reproductibility, etc). Why would we not ask the same with LLM or generative AI? It’s like everyone got so excited about models built on large datasets that they forgot we already had procedures for handling data.
Why would anyone give a shit whether Canada gets included in Google’s ai? They just foist this new shit that is effectively useless to the average person other than making shitty “art” and cheating on essay writing. They use it however they want while skirting copyright laws and trawling any data they can get their hands on.
Does anybody really think that ai under google is doing anything other than data-mining to sell advertising? Ai in it’s current form isn’t helping anyone except corporations and the billionaire class and almost everyone would be better off without it.
Not to rain on that parade, but there are some pretty inovative companies using AI for the betterment of society as a whole.
What we all hear and see in the media is really stupid corporate types of AI use, which ultimately will fail because AI lacks one thing we all possess, and that is feeling.
AI lacks the ability to insightfully mix in feeling to convey the output.
Where it’s great is where it’s all used for calculations similar to how super computers were used.
Raw calculations are not AI. The whole premise is that it will be able to understand/emulate human emotion. Else it’s just like the algorithms we’ve been developing since who knows how long.
AI is data scraping from a landfill of the internet.
The only difference is that it’s a gonewild version of it.
I’m sorry Dave, I’m afraid I can’t do that.
Tell me how it needs to be said for someone to feel like it’s a human empathetic response but it comes from AI.
We aren’t there. And as it progresses we will never be.
I’ll bet my last dollar that this AI movement for replacing people and jobs is nothing more than the same we have seen in the past with self checkouts, speech to text and the likes of that.
It will be uses in areas where data is finite, but human subjective is a different beast.
The Bard exclusion isn’t due to the news thing; it’s due to Canada having privacy laws and a privacy watchdog that actually pays attention. If Google expanded to Canada, they’d have to answer a bunch of questions it appears they’d rather avoid.
It’s true there are definitely privacy issues with it (esp. where future overlap with Google Docs would be concerned), but their reasoning in the article was “regulatory uncertainty.” At the very least, Alphabet & Google want people to think C-18 is the reason.
No. Canada might have different laws, but they are no more stringent than the EU or California. Surely there is differing regulations, and might be the market size that had it dropped in priority.
No loss for me. I don’t give a rat’s ass about AI chatbots. And I myself have excluded Google from my online activities. I use Debian Linux. My phone has LineageOS without Google Play Services – instead I use apps from f-droid, including OsmAnd~ for mapping. I never use Google search (I rely on DuckDuckGo). Any YouTube videos I may wish to view I use either FreeTube or Invidious (the latter via the Firefox addon LibRedirect). For translation, it’s LibreTranslate. If I wish to see news articles I’ll go directly to media sites such as The Star, The Globe and Mail, CBC, or via the news search on DuckDuckGo. Anyone who is still allowing themselves to be a product of Google is misguided, as far as I’m concerned.
You are not logged in. However you can subscribe from another Fediverse account, for example Lemmy or Mastodon. To do this, paste the following into the search field of your instance: !canada@lemmy.ca
Canada has long been excluded from a lot of newly releases products from a lot of American companies.
Most of the time it’s like they simply forget we exist. Or they don’t want to comply with our stronger consumer protection regulations, or labelling laws or anything else.
Even though this may be part of their whining about the latest law, it could also just be part of that long pattern.
Finally some privacy laws working in our favor.
I see no problem with this.
Man, whatever. Fuck big corporations anyway.
Google “do no evil” my ass. Lately I’ve become very tired of all these tech companies who think they control the internet. That’s not how internet works. I think they forgot how it really works.
And this AI shit? It’s kind of disappointing. And the reason for that is because of how corporations are trying to exploit it to maximise their profits just like everything/everybody else.
Technology in general, including AI, was supposed to make our lives easier. Make us need to work less to produce just as much or more. The goal was to have a utopia where nobody would have to work anymore and technology would take care of everything for us. But NOOOOOOO. We’re still working harder than ever just trying to get by, and if we can be replace by technology, then too fucking bad. You end up poor, homeless and you’re told by the same wealthy people who fired you and who are benefiting from technology to “pick yourself up by your bootstraps”.
Don’t care. Google is also being a baby and blocking Canadians from Canadian news.
Perhaps we should all move away from Google? They clearly can’t be trusted when their response to pay Canadian journalists for rehosting their content is “nah, we instead are going to block Canadian news”.
I don’t think it’s unfair to pay someone when you’re rehosting their stuff or driving away clicks by giving an article summary. Especially when there’s no Google without links. Just like Reddit doesn’t work without users submitting content. Not to mention it’s bold to play this game when there are plenty of Google alternatives now.
If you want to move away from google there are plenty of people on fedi who can help.
I switched to duck duck go a year ago and honestly I get my news quicker and more reliably from Lemmy, TikTok, and previously Reddit.
It’s actually scary how much I see from 50 different angles on TikTok before any news outlet even covers it, if even. Saw a stabbing in Toronto from multiple angles a few HOURS before I even seen an article about it.
I know Lemmy hates TikTok, but can’t deny it’s great for being up to date ASAP when it comes to news. At least for right now.
DDG which uses Bing to power its results will also have to comply by the same law or drop Canadian news results if they don’t want to negotiate and pay.
Canada has only specified Meta and Google as targets for the law.
The official list of digital news intermediaries hasn’t yet been published by the CRTC. Although Alphabet and Meta have been in the news, it’s very likely Microsoft will also be impacted and by proxy all services that use Bing (including Yahoo and DDG).
Microsoft doesn’t have a dominant market position in anything news-related, though. Why would they get targeted?
Why wouldn’t they? Microsoft operates the largest search engine used in Canada after Google, owns LinkedIn which is one of the top 10 social media platforms with a heavy news aggregation focus like Facebook, provides a default news aggregation feed pre-installed on all Windows computers, etc.
By the wording of the bill, there’s no reason they can’t be labeled as having a “prominent market position” or “a strategic advantage over news businesses”. And this applies especially so if Alphabet and Meta recuse themselves from the Canadian news market.
If the spirit of the bill is to get money from big corporations to support Canadian news organizations, then there’s no reason not to target Microsoft. And the fact that MS has already been consulted on the bill and released a statement about it strongly suggests they’ll be on the list.
Right. Which isn’t DDG wrongdoing. I’m not going to give DDG a strike for being caught in the crossfire.
I’m already only using the basic necessities from Microsoft because they are a shit company, just like the rest lol.
But we will also see what Microsoft does. They may comply and make Google look even more childish.
Didn’t the C18 specifically name google and meta?
The bill itself doesn’t name any specific company. It has a clause saying that the CRTC will publish and maintain a list of “digital news intermediaries” to which the contents of the bill apply. The official list isn’t yet available.
Ahhh, misunderstood the article I read then
“Reposting” as in linking to their content? Most other companies pay Google for that service.
How are those companies going to drive views to their site? Do you think Microsoft and Meta are going to play ball? They aren’t. Do you expect Lemmy instances to pay whenever someone uploads a Canadian news article?
Our country is a literal South Park meme right now. We’re just waiting on the bubble gum and Bennigans coupons.
This is borderline fascist legislation. Restricting the flow of information on the internet so that Canadians are forced to turn to traditional mainstream media for their news. It was never about money.
No it’s not. It’s dumb, sure; but it’s not fascism.
What’s your goal to preserve the 4th Estate?
deleted by creator
deleted by creator
Preserve the 4th estate? They’re probably waiting for an invite to the 5th column.
Google has apps that rehost content instead of linking to it. Also, many people only view the headline or the brief description, driving views away completely.
Like I said, search engines rely on content to work. You can already request your website be removed from Google, and prevent it from ever being crawled again. Imagine if everyone did this, Google would literally be useless. Google needs content to work. Google shows ads in their search engine, so they are getting paid by simply linking to your website.
Who said Meta and Microsoft wont play ball? Who said Lemmy is going to have to, is Lemmy a search engine? You’re losing the point.
Ya, because people like you are okay with Google censoring and blocking news to Canadians for… some reason? Not sure why.
Oh, there’s the south park coming out. It’s clear you’ve never created content online. What Google is doing is wrong, and Canadian journalists aren’t wrong for wanting to be paid for views that are taken away. It’s quite literally Google that is restricting the flow of information, so not sure why you’re blaming Canada.
All Google needs to do is pay pennies per click, just like they do with everything else. They are being a greedy American company who will slowly learn that they can’t treat the rest of the world like they do Americans. Look how great Google is. https://youtu.be/cA_cJAFF8Ss
Here is an alternative Piped link(s): https://piped.video/cA_cJAFF8Ss
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source, check me out at GitHub.
As someone who has had to actively contact an AI company and expressly deny use of digital images on our website, I’m confident there are no boundaries with what they scrape from the Internet. They don’t have any respect and slurp up everything in their path, which unfortunately leads to only one possible outcome - a culturally desensitised dataset. It will become the ‘neutral average’ of the internet, banal in many ways and biased in others. Don’t expect anything that resembles Canadian sentiment to come out of any non-Canadian AI (Same problem but different locale for me - UK/Eire).
Any that’s before it starts eating it’s own tail - there’s pictures of generative images where they fed data back in, and it’s as interesting as it is amusing and horrific. Keeping the data clean is an unsolved problem because it’s hard to differentiate organic and synthetic sources.
All of this pales into insignificance with (as far as I know) all AI lacking the ability to admit when it doesn’t know. It just makes it up from nothing.
I have access to ChatGPT, Bard, etc. I haven’t found a use for any of it yet (software engineering) where I trust it enough and the experiments I’ve run have proved this, for me personally. It’s a novelty, a toy, it will evolve. As for the Online News Act, I’m conflicted. I believe in a free and open Internet, which goes against both restrictive legislation and against the likes of Google and Meta who abuse their position in the online landscape. My instinct is I’d rather have the Online News Act than Bard as the publisher should own their content, so good luck with that.
This! I see the hype around AI and it’s like everyone has lost their mind. You wouldn’t accept a statistical study without sampling info (dataset size, origin, selection, filtering, bias, reproductibility, etc). Why would we not ask the same with LLM or generative AI? It’s like everyone got so excited about models built on large datasets that they forgot we already had procedures for handling data.
its a tool. like a wrench. Use it as its meant to be used, it works great. Unfortunately, it is possible to use a wrench to pound in a screw.
Oh dear. A megacorporation who is noted for not following rules or respecting boundaries is going to lock Canada out.
How can we help all countries match this feat?
Why would anyone give a shit whether Canada gets included in Google’s ai? They just foist this new shit that is effectively useless to the average person other than making shitty “art” and cheating on essay writing. They use it however they want while skirting copyright laws and trawling any data they can get their hands on.
Does anybody really think that ai under google is doing anything other than data-mining to sell advertising? Ai in it’s current form isn’t helping anyone except corporations and the billionaire class and almost everyone would be better off without it.
Not to rain on that parade, but there are some pretty inovative companies using AI for the betterment of society as a whole. What we all hear and see in the media is really stupid corporate types of AI use, which ultimately will fail because AI lacks one thing we all possess, and that is feeling. AI lacks the ability to insightfully mix in feeling to convey the output.
Where it’s great is where it’s all used for calculations similar to how super computers were used.
Raw calculations are not AI. The whole premise is that it will be able to understand/emulate human emotion. Else it’s just like the algorithms we’ve been developing since who knows how long.
AI is data scraping from a landfill of the internet. The only difference is that it’s a gonewild version of it. I’m sorry Dave, I’m afraid I can’t do that.
Tell me how it needs to be said for someone to feel like it’s a human empathetic response but it comes from AI. We aren’t there. And as it progresses we will never be.
I’ll bet my last dollar that this AI movement for replacing people and jobs is nothing more than the same we have seen in the past with self checkouts, speech to text and the likes of that. It will be uses in areas where data is finite, but human subjective is a different beast.
Barred from Bard!
Lucky them.
The Bard exclusion isn’t due to the news thing; it’s due to Canada having privacy laws and a privacy watchdog that actually pays attention. If Google expanded to Canada, they’d have to answer a bunch of questions it appears they’d rather avoid.
The Canadian privacy watchdog does things? I doubt bard is any more data invasive than meta platforms and they get a pass…
A lot of people seem to have misunderstood what I said.
The Canadian watchdog asks questions Google likely doesn’t want asked.
It’s not about penalties, it’s about asking questions that others might then also ask.
It’s true there are definitely privacy issues with it (esp. where future overlap with Google Docs would be concerned), but their reasoning in the article was “regulatory uncertainty.” At the very least, Alphabet & Google want people to think C-18 is the reason.
Why do we have bing chatgpt4 then?
I was under the impression that the EU has pretty strict privacy laws and oversight. Is Canada stricter?
Not strict enough. Should be better we need a GDPR
No. Canada might have different laws, but they are no more stringent than the EU or California. Surely there is differing regulations, and might be the market size that had it dropped in priority.
This is right, it’s not hard to imagine that compliance is part of a ROI equation along with number of users.
EU has a population of 700 million vs Canada’s 40.
Excuse me. Canada is gaining like 100K new people per day. That’s 41 mili… 42 m… 45 million to you!
That sounds like a good thing.
No loss for me. I don’t give a rat’s ass about AI chatbots. And I myself have excluded Google from my online activities. I use Debian Linux. My phone has LineageOS without Google Play Services – instead I use apps from f-droid, including OsmAnd~ for mapping. I never use Google search (I rely on DuckDuckGo). Any YouTube videos I may wish to view I use either FreeTube or Invidious (the latter via the Firefox addon LibRedirect). For translation, it’s LibreTranslate. If I wish to see news articles I’ll go directly to media sites such as The Star, The Globe and Mail, CBC, or via the news search on DuckDuckGo. Anyone who is still allowing themselves to be a product of Google is misguided, as far as I’m concerned.
Too bad, they’ll lose even more marketshare in the AI business on top of losing in the search business.