Hi all!
I used to be a daily r/selfhosted lurker and a bit active user.
Since the Reddit saga I thought that r/selfhosted would be one of the first and bigger community to move to Lemmy due to the IT knowledge of all of their users and the sensitivity about self host/privacy/open source, but I see that not only the community is still all there, but it’s rising. :(
That really makes me sad.
How can we convince the mods there to move people here?
Is it allowed to talk about Lemmy on Reddit or do we risk of being banned?
Well firstly, why do you care about being banned if you’re leaving Reddit?
Come to terms with Reddit not dying overnight. Lemmy isn’t going to vanish if people don’t move over straight away. Reddit will eventually succumb to the 1000s of tiny self-inflicted cuts. Post content that isn’t on Reddit and people will have a motivation to stay here.
Make Lemmy the place to be when reddit kills the next thing, and the next thing, and the next thing. Yeah we’re small, but we’re something crazy like almost 10x the size we were before the 3rd party app shitshow.
We aim to be the place where people can migrate to next time reddit causes a freakout, like killing old reddit
Subscriber numbers mean little. Take a look at the trend for the posts per day and comments per day graphs. They’re far more accurate indicators of the level of engagement actual users are having with reddit.
I’ve just checked for 10 of the subs I used to subscribe to, 2 of which have over 30m subscribers - all of them have the same downward trend in terms of posts and comments. I’m not saying reddit is in trouble but less new content is being created and that which is is being talked about less, eventually that will take a toll.
If you look at the charts you linked, you can see the users activity (post per day and comments per day) is falling sharply since last month. Subscribers count mean nothing if a big proportion of the active posters leave.
If you look at the chart, pretty much nothing comparable to the same period last year. January 2023 is a lot higher than January 2022 for example. July 2023 is also higher than July 2022.
It’s interesting how Lemmy shows active users before subscribing. Even reddit shows “readers” (people currently online), but people hyperfocus on subscribers (which can be dead accounts).
I’d prefer if we stopped bringing up Reddit altogether. We no longer use the platform, we should be happy with what we have here instead of constantly peeping into the neighbor’s garden.
the scum stays in the puddle of mud. just like ppl still being on fb or twitter…they create nothing new. and so is r/selfhosted …they will repeat their stacks over and over again.
it’s like asking people for advice on music…on myspace in 2023.
oooor, imagine this: they are just nice and yet create nothin new?
when was the last good music recommendation you found on myspace? maybe there are still good music things on but nobody gives a fuck and those still using myspace,fb or r/selfhostes are just pathetic and keep riding a dead horse.
The change will come once people start searching for stuff on Google and they get results which link back to lemmy.
For that to happen we need people asking for help/feedback and getting their answers here.
It’s definitely progress and seeing myself in one of the top results was nice but it’s going to take a lot more work and tbh the decentralised nature of the links might also hurt because clicking on the dbzero link looks like a hackerman link if you know what I mean
I’m happy to help provide answers on my fields of interests but they are pretty much dead on Lemmy for now, it’s a chicken and egg thing.
It doesn’t help that because we don’t really have good algorithms, my feed is dominated by generalist topics, memes, news and tech stuff. So even if I subscribe to smaller communities, if I don’t intentionally go visit them they’re never in my feed.
We need to better surface posts from smaller communities by having a weighted algorithm so that your feed is a mix of big and small communities.
This was actually mentioned in an issue on the github. I can’t quite remember whether it was turned down or just inactive. I totally agree. If we’re going to compete with big social medias then we also need some kind of algorithms. Opt-in/out of course.
My understanding was that hot was just posts with rapidly increasing upvotes, but it’s still not weighed between big and small (could definitely be wrong).
Google’s algorithm might actively down-rank Lemmy sites though, as the messages appear duplicated on multiple sites, which is usually a sign of SEO blog spam.
Probably needs a change on Google’s side to better recognize federated websites. Not impossible that they will do this, lets see.
There are a handful of factors that play a role in canonicalization: […], and rel="canonical"link annotations.
(but Google considers it a hint, so they don’t have to honor it)
Also, that change was just for Lemmy. Other Fediverse sites may not do the same, which would lessen the effect. For example, from a quick look at a random federated post on kbin.social, there was no such <link rel="canonical"/> element present in the page source.
It surprises me too on some level because it does seem very obvious.
I’ve also learned on multiple occasions over the years that I value different things and I value them much more strongly than a large swath of the selfhosting community. That may speak to whether or not people selfhost for ideological, practical, or other reasons that I am unaware of but, at the end of the day, I find myself disappointed that the version of the selfhosting community that I imagined and thought I was on the same page with is simply not the selfhosting community that exists.
The issue is I’m keen on following the self-hosting / server specific content but generally I’ve got nothing exciting to add. I can offer upvotes and kbin boosts 🚀
You are not logged in. However you can subscribe from another Fediverse account, for example Lemmy or Mastodon. To do this, paste the following into the search field of your instance: !selfhosted@lemmy.world
A place to share alternatives to popular online services that can be self-hosted without giving up privacy or locking you into a service you don’t control.
Rules:
Be civil: we’re here to support and learn from one another. Insults won’t be tolerated. Flame wars are frowned upon.
No spam posting.
Posts have to be centered around self-hosting. There are other communities for discussing hardware or home computing. If it’s not obvious why your post topic revolves around selfhosting, please include details to make it clear.
Don’t duplicate the full text of your blog or github here. Just post the link for folks to click.
Submission headline should match the article title (don’t cherry-pick information from the title to fit your agenda).
Do what you can to make this the place you want to be.
Well firstly, why do you care about being banned if you’re leaving Reddit?
Come to terms with Reddit not dying overnight. Lemmy isn’t going to vanish if people don’t move over straight away. Reddit will eventually succumb to the 1000s of tiny self-inflicted cuts. Post content that isn’t on Reddit and people will have a motivation to stay here.
Make Lemmy the place to be when reddit kills the next thing, and the next thing, and the next thing. Yeah we’re small, but we’re something crazy like almost 10x the size we were before the 3rd party app shitshow.
We aim to be the place where people can migrate to next time reddit causes a freakout, like killing old reddit
Subscriber numbers mean little. Take a look at the trend for the posts per day and comments per day graphs. They’re far more accurate indicators of the level of engagement actual users are having with reddit.
I’ve just checked for 10 of the subs I used to subscribe to, 2 of which have over 30m subscribers - all of them have the same downward trend in terms of posts and comments. I’m not saying reddit is in trouble but less new content is being created and that which is is being talked about less, eventually that will take a toll.
Neat, where are you pulling these graphs?
Check the link in OP’s post.
If you look at the charts you linked, you can see the users activity (post per day and comments per day) is falling sharply since last month. Subscribers count mean nothing if a big proportion of the active posters leave.
Makes sense, the people who have both the tech knowledge and conviction on the advantages of selfhosting, were probably the most active posters.
The new subscribers are probably bots.
100% how spez started out initially and made it appear that reddit had a lot of activity. So this definitely smells like spez-tricks
Definitely. Inflating numbers for the sake of the upcoming IpO
Post per day seams steady at about 30/40, comment per day seams to have dropped from 3/400 to 250/300, I would have expected a great fall.
If you compare post per days from before the strike, it definitely falls. It’s no longer an upward trajectory despite subscribers growth.
You need to compare with the same period last year.
If you look at the chart, pretty much nothing comparable to the same period last year. January 2023 is a lot higher than January 2022 for example. July 2023 is also higher than July 2022.
Yeah I wouldnt be surprised if spez is bolstering subscriber numbers for larger subs with bot accounts
It’s interesting how Lemmy shows active users before subscribing. Even reddit shows “readers” (people currently online), but people hyperfocus on subscribers (which can be dead accounts).
If you link to Lemmy on Reddit, the admins sometimes delete the comment.
Hahaah some mods in r/greece are doing exactly than too
Admins or mods? Two very different groups.
Oh, oops you are rught sorry *mods
Lol I used a script to overwrite my 13 years of fairly active redditing with a join-lemmy.org link
I’ve read that Reddit was recovering them all. Are yours still gone?
I checked earlier today and, at a cursory doomscroll, everything appears to remain deleted so far
Help? What did you use?
I used this: https://redact.dev/
You would think, of all the communities that would be comfortable with migration, it would be the folks from
/r/selfhosted!Fellow user from there, btw, nice to see we’ve got a decent pool of people on this board instead.
Well that’s probably a reason why this community is so strong compared to other nieche communities
Totally agree. Thought the same when the reddit shitstorm happened.
Stop obsessing about Reddit and create a content on Lemmy instead. People will come once they see there’s enough activity here.
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Yah but that seems to be what lemmy is turning out to be and I don’t see it being sustainable.
I’d prefer if we stopped bringing up Reddit altogether. We no longer use the platform, we should be happy with what we have here instead of constantly peeping into the neighbor’s garden.
It’s not an obsession! Simply if all the good poster/commenter that are there would come here, this place would be better!
I am not a good boi?
Be the change you want to see.
You thought they were the leaders. They’re the followers, staying near the crowd.
Building communities is hard and takes time.
This is the third ng. Fuck reddit. Just post and it’s all G
The OP has double the posts you do?
It’s still a correct statement
Exactly. Chill out. It’s not a competition.
Just hang out and enjoy the community.
Well… I hosted nothing myself, but now I host my own Lemmy instance :o)
More subscribers… check More comment… maybe check Quality content… nah
I use RSS to get r/selfhosted post and I can guarantee that most posts are amateurs asking questions.
What do you mean? I’m here!
😁
it is good.
the scum stays in the puddle of mud. just like ppl still being on fb or twitter…they create nothing new. and so is r/selfhosted …they will repeat their stacks over and over again. it’s like asking people for advice on music…on myspace in 2023.
Oh come on, that’s not true and you know it. There’s still good people there (in r/selfhosted) posting good stuff.
Edit: specified that I’m talking about r/selfhosted and not MySpace.
because the drain has just started maybe?
oooor, imagine this: they are just nice and yet create nothin new?
when was the last good music recommendation you found on myspace? maybe there are still good music things on but nobody gives a fuck and those still using myspace,fb or r/selfhostes are just pathetic and keep riding a dead horse.
I was still talking about r/selfhosted!
me too. reddit, myspace…dead horses. and those that chose to keep on riding it will have a terrible smell
The change will come once people start searching for stuff on Google and they get results which link back to lemmy. For that to happen we need people asking for help/feedback and getting their answers here.
The most useful comment in this entire thread, the search results are a bit of a mess currently and that’s a huge stumbling block.
I tried a simple search query with lemmy and the way results come back is not good
it’s going to take a long time for that to change but just as a casual user I doubt I’d click anything past the first few reddit links.
The fact we’re on the first screen of results is progress! 🎉
It’s definitely progress and seeing myself in one of the top results was nice but it’s going to take a lot more work and tbh the decentralised nature of the links might also hurt because clicking on the dbzero link looks like a hackerman link if you know what I mean
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I’m happy to help provide answers on my fields of interests but they are pretty much dead on Lemmy for now, it’s a chicken and egg thing.
It doesn’t help that because we don’t really have good algorithms, my feed is dominated by generalist topics, memes, news and tech stuff. So even if I subscribe to smaller communities, if I don’t intentionally go visit them they’re never in my feed.
We need to better surface posts from smaller communities by having a weighted algorithm so that your feed is a mix of big and small communities.
This was actually mentioned in an issue on the github. I can’t quite remember whether it was turned down or just inactive. I totally agree. If we’re going to compete with big social medias then we also need some kind of algorithms. Opt-in/out of course.
Isn’t Hot supposed to work like that? When it’s not broken, of course.
I feel like some simple algorithm like the ones used in dithering may be used to mix up the feed.
My understanding was that hot was just posts with rapidly increasing upvotes, but it’s still not weighed between big and small (could definitely be wrong).
You’re probably right. I should go check out the source at some point.
correct and also back linking on our blogs/medium posts/etc…
Hmm does Lemmy need search engine optimization? I have no idea how seo works these days :/
Google’s algorithm might actively down-rank Lemmy sites though, as the messages appear duplicated on multiple sites, which is usually a sign of SEO blog spam.
Probably needs a change on Google’s side to better recognize federated websites. Not impossible that they will do this, lets see.
As of v0.18.2, Lemmy marks the “original URL” as the canonical URL so search engines know which page is the “real” one. Shouldn’t that help?
Maybe? I guess Google would need to actively look for that.
According to their develop pages, they do look for that:
(but Google considers it a hint, so they don’t have to honor it)
Also, that change was just for Lemmy. Other Fediverse sites may not do the same, which would lessen the effect. For example, from a quick look at a random federated post on kbin.social, there was no such
<link rel="canonical"/>element present in the page source.Good to know. Might be worth making an issue report on kbin for that: https://codeberg.org/Kbin/kbin-core
Someone already made one 3 hours ago. Though apparently it won’t help by itself, since their
robots.txtdisallows indexing anyway (and that same issue also requests that to be adjusted).It surprises me too on some level because it does seem very obvious.
I’ve also learned on multiple occasions over the years that I value different things and I value them much more strongly than a large swath of the selfhosting community. That may speak to whether or not people selfhost for ideological, practical, or other reasons that I am unaware of but, at the end of the day, I find myself disappointed that the version of the selfhosting community that I imagined and thought I was on the same page with is simply not the selfhosting community that exists.
What does the self-hosting community value, then?
The issue is I’m keen on following the self-hosting / server specific content but generally I’ve got nothing exciting to add. I can offer upvotes and kbin boosts 🚀
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