Last week, I turned on my PC, installed a Windows update, and rebooted to find Microsoft Edge automatically open with the Chrome tabs I was working on before the update. I don’t use Microsoft Edge regularly, and I have Google Chrome set as my default browser. Bleary-eyed at 9AM, it took me a moment to realize that Microsoft Edge had simply taken over where I’d left off in Chrome. I couldn’t believe my eyes.
I’ve been a lifelong windows user (well and DOS and whatever cartridge I used with the C64/C128) but I think it’s just time to uninstall the OS instead.
Depends on your needs. For a lot of users, I think the current Linux desktop experience is sufficient. If you have more specific needs, I can see why you’d stick with Windows.
That’s hilarious. I was a full time IT admin earlier in my career and still have run Linux full time for well over a decade now. For anything proprietary, i have a qemu image.
Of course, now I’m a DevOps admin so I get play with linux all day, for $$$! Hundreds of servers of all distros! Ubuntu, Cent, RHEL, Alpine containers… My big task this year is to get off Docker/Mesos and into OCI/Kubernettes. It’s going to be an incredible project.
Weird, I switched my daily driver in December 2022 over to Mint (likewise I’ve been using Linux for various things since '08, so not a noob) and it’s been pretty damn solid since then, including upgrades from Mint 20 to 21 and all of the Mint 21 point releases.
I admit that Mint is the distro I got the furthest with, several weeks in I just stopped being able to do full screen 3d. I spent a month and a half on forums trying to figure it out including 2 clean installs and couldn’t get anywhere.
I even did board level diagnostics on my video card.
Just gave up and went back to windows, never had an issue there and still don’t.
I’ll use linux for remote servers or fun little house gadgets, but as much as I hate windows, (and I hate windows with the seething glowing magma aged bitterness of someone who has had to support it since WIndows 3.11.
I would LOVE to ditch it, especially now, but until I can get a clean install to doing what I need to do in under a day, I can’t advocate linux.
I have tried to switch my daily driver to linux for more than 15 years now, Linux desktop just isn’t ready.
Something isn’t adding up here. I switched to mostly Linux around 2003. By 2005 it was all Linux unless I got paid for it. My wife has been only Linux since then and she doesn’t really know how to use a computer and doesn’t want to. Linux just works for her.
I do all my work from a Linux desktop and two Linux laptops. Well and a Steamdeck I use as a desktop when traveling. I remote into windows machines when I am using windows for jobs. Sometimes desktops, sometimes Azure virtual desktops, but my local client is always Linux.
I have an MSDN, I admin Azure instances, SQL servers, Windows Servers, and work on Windows desktops. Over the last two to three years it has been the windows machines that are the most annoying and troublesome. Linux is just easy and just works.
The Linux desktop is ready. Has been ready. Something is going on with your situation. Could be breaking old habits, could be hardware. I don’t know. But saying Linux is to blame here is ridiculous.
Habits and hardware are definitely the big ones to overcome. I still remember how absolutely lost I felt the first couple times I tried installing slackware in the 90s. I could install/set up windows in my sleep. But then slackware dropped to an unfamiliar command prompt, I can’t dir, there isn’t even a C drive, and now I’m expected to configure something called xfree86. Luckily I wasn’t told to use vi or I’d be stuck there to this day.
New users aren’t thrown into the deep end quite like that anymore, but it’s still a big change for a windows power user. So much of what you learned is not applicable or just the wrong way to do things. Mac users and Windows non-power-users seem to have a much easier time accepting the changes.
It’s definitely not for everyone (is any OS?) but it’s been ‘ready’ as a desktop OS for me since Mandrake 8 in ~2001. That’s about when I ditched windows 2000 and haven’t looked back.
You think it’s impossible that Windows, an operating system with whole teams of people paid well to work on design and UX could be easier to use than Linux desktop which is primarily people working in their spare time?
Did I say that? I said windows has caused me more issues lately. I was replying that Linux desktop is fine. It works. Has worked for a very long time.
But since you brought it up… No. I do not think Windows is an easier desktop to use. Depends on familiarity and what you want to do with it. They can’t get single click right. They can’t get multiple desktops right. They certainly do not have activities. If you are using a Gnome workflow, windows seems almost insane in comparison. Don’t get me started on the ads and what this whole discussion started about with Edge trying to push itself into your way. And how about that registry system? So intuitive and useful right?
It’s not just that, I had unending problems when I tried last and most of the help I received online was incredibly combative (“you shouldn’t want to do that”) or just asking me to switch distro and start again, of course the distro recommended was different each time
Which distro did you try last time? Just for future reference.
I’ve installed Linux mint for a family member on a netbook back in 2008, and it worked splendid ootb. At least for surfing the web, watching streams and movies and playing Solitaire or something. But can’t expect too much from a netbook.
Mint. Had problems with device drivers, with things I used for my job not having proper software support. With having to edit config based on a dream and a whole lot of guesswork just to make some peripherals work. Being told that a config setting I use on windows need not exist on Linux because I can just buy different hardware…
For what it’s worth, I’ve found that windows and mac forums have similar issues if you approach them as an outsider.
I feel similar frustration when faced with trying to accomplish things on those OSes. Mac forums in particular are terrible about “you shouldn’t want to do that”.
It doesn’t solve your problem, just wanted to share that I’ve experienced it from the other side.
Alternatively, buy or 🏴☠️KMSpico🏴☠️ yourself a pro license, and use group policy so it’s one and done. Microsoft has built in tools for almost all of this that don’t get rolled over by updates.
Getting tired of people claiming that it’s impossible to decrap Windows.
Obtuse? Sure! Features that shouldn’t be hidden behind an upgraded license? Hell fucking yes!
Impossible? Fuck no, hell no.
Learning basic Windows admin stuff, especially just the debloating/configuration things, is comparable in difficulty to switching to Linux.
Don’t get me wrong, I love Linux and less reliance on Microsoft is awesome, but 90% of complaints about Windows come from people who don’t know how to configure it, how to use the tools Microsoft offers to decrap it, and how to make it work for them. They’ll hit similar problems with most Linux distros as soon as you go deeper than basic “office suite and web browser” usage.
I’m not saying it’s impossible. I’m just saying I shouldn’t have to decrap a piece of software I actually paid for. Over and over. Also, whenever they introduce some new crap it usually comes with new GPOs that also have to be enabled to remove it again. It’s like whack-a-mole.
Obtuse? Sure! Features that shouldn’t be hidden behind an upgraded license? Hell fucking yes!
This is what I was saying really. This crap should never have been there in the first place as it’s consumer-hostile.
Impossible? Fuck no, hell no.
I never said this :) I said it was annoying having to do it every time. Yeah I have pro. And I know what GPOs are. But really, you can’t expect an average consumer to do this. Also, it’s less work to just change things back manually every time than to figure all the GPOs needed. It’s really just super annoying that it happens in the first place. I expect software I buy to be made to help me, not work against me.
And I never mentioned Linux in my post even though I use it myself. I know this is not a suitable alternative for the majority.
If you’ve got a few windows machines on your network and some sysadmin skills, you can run a Zentyal server to set up the GPOs. Syncs across your machines, and you can add a new one at any time that will also get de-shittified instantly.
you should use MAS instead of Pico https://massgrave.dev
also, gpos are just templates for the registry, you can just look them up and apply manually (ehich is actually faster than finding anything in the official gpo editor), unless you’re a sysadmin and managing a whole fleet of machines (this is what gpo editor was actually made for) there’s no real need for it.
As a gentoo user, I’m always confused when people think gentoo is about multi-day compiles. Rebuilding the whole system takes a few hours (not that I ever need to do that), and binary packages are available for the big stuff if you want it. It’s basically just arch with more configuration options.
Not insisting you or anyone should run it, but it’s not as ridiculous as people seem to think.
I’ve started using Ansible to apply windows settings and manage packages because of this. It’s a bit of work to setup the playbooks but I just run it occasionally on my windows hosts to keep Microsoft from reverting settings or reinstalling junk.
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And do this every time the system gets a major update because it puts all the crapware right back 🫣
I’ve been a lifelong windows user (well and DOS and whatever cartridge I used with the C64/C128) but I think it’s just time to uninstall the OS instead.
I would love to ditch windows but Linux desktop just isn’t ready
I think gnome at least is there now
Not much you can’t do from a gui, it works pretty reliably
Most people myself included use commandline package managers though, so I’m not sure what state graphical interfaces on them are in right now
Depends on your needs. For a lot of users, I think the current Linux desktop experience is sufficient. If you have more specific needs, I can see why you’d stick with Windows.
bollocks
The amount of issues I had last time I tried says otherwise
I have tried to switch my daily driver to linux for more than 15 years now, Linux desktop just isn’t ready.
Full disclosure: I am an IT admin with near 3 decades of experience, including administrating linux servers, so this isn’t a skill gap.
That’s hilarious. I was a full time IT admin earlier in my career and still have run Linux full time for well over a decade now. For anything proprietary, i have a qemu image.
Of course, now I’m a DevOps admin so I get play with linux all day, for $$$! Hundreds of servers of all distros! Ubuntu, Cent, RHEL, Alpine containers… My big task this year is to get off Docker/Mesos and into OCI/Kubernettes. It’s going to be an incredible project.
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Weird, I switched my daily driver in December 2022 over to Mint (likewise I’ve been using Linux for various things since '08, so not a noob) and it’s been pretty damn solid since then, including upgrades from Mint 20 to 21 and all of the Mint 21 point releases.
Do you game often?
That’s the main use of my main rig, so yes.
Steam with Proton-GE works great. For everything else I use Heroic Games Launcher and the Linux native itch.io launcher.
Mint was the last one I tried and it was awful, really buggy and poor UX
I admit that Mint is the distro I got the furthest with, several weeks in I just stopped being able to do full screen 3d. I spent a month and a half on forums trying to figure it out including 2 clean installs and couldn’t get anywhere.
I even did board level diagnostics on my video card.
Just gave up and went back to windows, never had an issue there and still don’t.
I’ll use linux for remote servers or fun little house gadgets, but as much as I hate windows, (and I hate windows with the seething glowing magma aged bitterness of someone who has had to support it since WIndows 3.11.
I would LOVE to ditch it, especially now, but until I can get a clean install to doing what I need to do in under a day, I can’t advocate linux.
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Something isn’t adding up here. I switched to mostly Linux around 2003. By 2005 it was all Linux unless I got paid for it. My wife has been only Linux since then and she doesn’t really know how to use a computer and doesn’t want to. Linux just works for her.
I do all my work from a Linux desktop and two Linux laptops. Well and a Steamdeck I use as a desktop when traveling. I remote into windows machines when I am using windows for jobs. Sometimes desktops, sometimes Azure virtual desktops, but my local client is always Linux.
I have an MSDN, I admin Azure instances, SQL servers, Windows Servers, and work on Windows desktops. Over the last two to three years it has been the windows machines that are the most annoying and troublesome. Linux is just easy and just works.
The Linux desktop is ready. Has been ready. Something is going on with your situation. Could be breaking old habits, could be hardware. I don’t know. But saying Linux is to blame here is ridiculous.
Nearly identical story here, and I agree.
Habits and hardware are definitely the big ones to overcome. I still remember how absolutely lost I felt the first couple times I tried installing slackware in the 90s. I could install/set up windows in my sleep. But then slackware dropped to an unfamiliar command prompt, I can’t dir, there isn’t even a C drive, and now I’m expected to configure something called xfree86. Luckily I wasn’t told to use vi or I’d be stuck there to this day.
New users aren’t thrown into the deep end quite like that anymore, but it’s still a big change for a windows power user. So much of what you learned is not applicable or just the wrong way to do things. Mac users and Windows non-power-users seem to have a much easier time accepting the changes.
It’s definitely not for everyone (is any OS?) but it’s been ‘ready’ as a desktop OS for me since Mandrake 8 in ~2001. That’s about when I ditched windows 2000 and haven’t looked back.
You think it’s impossible that Windows, an operating system with whole teams of people paid well to work on design and UX could be easier to use than Linux desktop which is primarily people working in their spare time?
Did I say that? I said windows has caused me more issues lately. I was replying that Linux desktop is fine. It works. Has worked for a very long time.
But since you brought it up… No. I do not think Windows is an easier desktop to use. Depends on familiarity and what you want to do with it. They can’t get single click right. They can’t get multiple desktops right. They certainly do not have activities. If you are using a Gnome workflow, windows seems almost insane in comparison. Don’t get me started on the ads and what this whole discussion started about with Edge trying to push itself into your way. And how about that registry system? So intuitive and useful right?
It looks ready to me. Just need to figure out equivalents in software, many which I’m sure are similar or better.
It’s not just that, I had unending problems when I tried last and most of the help I received online was incredibly combative (“you shouldn’t want to do that”) or just asking me to switch distro and start again, of course the distro recommended was different each time
Which distro did you try last time? Just for future reference.
I’ve installed Linux mint for a family member on a netbook back in 2008, and it worked splendid ootb. At least for surfing the web, watching streams and movies and playing Solitaire or something. But can’t expect too much from a netbook.
Mint. Had problems with device drivers, with things I used for my job not having proper software support. With having to edit config based on a dream and a whole lot of guesswork just to make some peripherals work. Being told that a config setting I use on windows need not exist on Linux because I can just buy different hardware…
For what it’s worth, I’ve found that windows and mac forums have similar issues if you approach them as an outsider.
I feel similar frustration when faced with trying to accomplish things on those OSes. Mac forums in particular are terrible about “you shouldn’t want to do that”.
It doesn’t solve your problem, just wanted to share that I’ve experienced it from the other side.
Alternatively, buy or 🏴☠️KMSpico🏴☠️ yourself a pro license, and use group policy so it’s one and done. Microsoft has built in tools for almost all of this that don’t get rolled over by updates.
Getting tired of people claiming that it’s impossible to decrap Windows.
Obtuse? Sure! Features that shouldn’t be hidden behind an upgraded license? Hell fucking yes!
Impossible? Fuck no, hell no.
Learning basic Windows admin stuff, especially just the debloating/configuration things, is comparable in difficulty to switching to Linux.
Don’t get me wrong, I love Linux and less reliance on Microsoft is awesome, but 90% of complaints about Windows come from people who don’t know how to configure it, how to use the tools Microsoft offers to decrap it, and how to make it work for them. They’ll hit similar problems with most Linux distros as soon as you go deeper than basic “office suite and web browser” usage.
I’m not saying it’s impossible. I’m just saying I shouldn’t have to decrap a piece of software I actually paid for. Over and over. Also, whenever they introduce some new crap it usually comes with new GPOs that also have to be enabled to remove it again. It’s like whack-a-mole.
This is what I was saying really. This crap should never have been there in the first place as it’s consumer-hostile.
I never said this :) I said it was annoying having to do it every time. Yeah I have pro. And I know what GPOs are. But really, you can’t expect an average consumer to do this. Also, it’s less work to just change things back manually every time than to figure all the GPOs needed. It’s really just super annoying that it happens in the first place. I expect software I buy to be made to help me, not work against me.
And I never mentioned Linux in my post even though I use it myself. I know this is not a suitable alternative for the majority.
If you’ve got a few windows machines on your network and some sysadmin skills, you can run a Zentyal server to set up the GPOs. Syncs across your machines, and you can add a new one at any time that will also get de-shittified instantly.
I think, my reason for switching stemmed from me getting bored if decrapifying windows and wanting to hsebsomething awesome to begin with
if its comparable in difficulty, why not just switch to a system that does what you want on the first place?
Most GPOs just set registry settings. So theoretically you don’t even need pro, just to set the right registry values and write-protect them
Well yes but GPOs overrule registry settings (if a user or the OS flips a registry setting, the GPO will switch it back on the next reboot).
you don’t need to write protect them, except options related to ms defender. (which can be removed as “malware” by the defender)
they won’t get reset.
I dunno hey, for some reason an update caused edge to re-enable it’s BS homescreen spam content
you should use MAS instead of Pico
https://massgrave.dev
also, gpos are just templates for the registry, you can just look them up and apply manually (ehich is actually faster than finding anything in the official gpo editor), unless you’re a sysadmin and managing a whole fleet of machines (this is what gpo editor was actually made for) there’s no real need for it.
No need for KMS Pico anymore. There are better tools out there.
Go on…
MAS Activation Script - HWID Activation
Install Gentoo
I’d prefer to stick with windows for gaming capabilities. Thanks though.
Oh no it’d just a silly joke. I was not being serious. You can game on Linux though
Yeah. I just don’t wanna finagle around in cli. I do that a lot at work lol
fuck gentoo, spending an entire week compiling shit is not something i want to do
I’d rather stick with arch or fedora
Chill dude. It’s just a meme. I use Debian btw
As a gentoo user, I’m always confused when people think gentoo is about multi-day compiles. Rebuilding the whole system takes a few hours (not that I ever need to do that), and binary packages are available for the big stuff if you want it. It’s basically just arch with more configuration options.
Not insisting you or anyone should run it, but it’s not as ridiculous as people seem to think.
I’ve started using Ansible to apply windows settings and manage packages because of this. It’s a bit of work to setup the playbooks but I just run it occasionally on my windows hosts to keep Microsoft from reverting settings or reinstalling junk.