Good on them. I would refuse it too. Personally I find it abhorrent that we as a society still allow this one person to be a king just because he was born into the magic family.
We already have a Canadian Governor General doing the actual job, why not just formalize it and do away eyes the crown.
We already have a Canadian Governor General doing the actual job, why not just formalize it and do away eyes the crown.
The Governor General is appointed by the Crown as its representative, technically. You can’t have the former without the latter.
We could move to having an elected President as head of state as well as a Prime Minister who tends to the day-to-day business of government, as some other countries like France do, but it wouldn’t really change much of anything . . . except adding the trouble and expense of another federal election. Seems like a lot of work for nothing to me.
Then again, I have no Indigenous ancestry and no bad history with the Crown, and I can see why people in the Yukon might feel differently about it.
I think we could. In practice they are chosen by the Prime Minister, so we could formalize this practice locally without the crown, but without resorting to an unnecessary election.
Why not have the Prime Minister appoint the President, who must be confirmed by parliament, and keep the role of the President to be mostly ceremonial. Not much changes from today except the removal of the Crown.
The oath of allegiance can be changed to that of a republic which represents all humans in Canada.
I believe that would require the federal government to amend the constitution which is no simple feat.
All premiers would have to agree to the changes which opens a whole can of worms since Quebec never formally signed on the original constitution, and the other premiers would very likely demand other changes be made as well to suit their own political agenda.
Then the provinces would need to have their own legislative amendments made to recognize the changes in both the constitution, which would also take time to pass as well.
If there is a change in government on either the federal or provincial level, and the party has a vested interest to undo those changes, all that progress gets flushed down the drain.
Yes absolutely, any change to the monarchy needs a constitutional amendment, which basically means “not gonna happen” because of everything you outlined, unless there’s a massive shift in opinion among Canadians.
The best short term outcome here is probably for the Canadian government and courts to just conveniently ignore or bend some rules… let these people swear an oath of allegiance to the constitution and let a judge do some hand wavy legal magic and say “hmm, close enough”.
I like to think of it like a zoo exhibit, come and see the orangutans. The royals have no real power in our society, and I’m sure every party has legislation prepped to abolish the monarchy if they ever try anything other than what they’re told. So long as they keep bringing in more money than it costs to feed em I can see keeping them around.
That being said we should start working on removing them from government ceremonies like this. Why not swear to the people, or on the charter or something.
So what happens when the byelection is called and the same people are elected and refuse to pledge allegiance? Another countdown timer?
It is a tricky situation where two governance structures collide. We really need to modify the constitution such that the GG replaces the Crown in all matters of state. They do all the work already anyway.
I mean for these kind of nut jobs I can’t imagine pledging to the GG is actually significantly better than the Crown. I say that because I’m also such a nut job, at least in principle.
For anyone who has been to the Yukon Territory and gazed upon its majesty, King Charles can get fucked. That province may as well be a wild horse. Even Alaska is a giant let-down by comparison.
Born and raised here. It’s nice if you love the outdoors and nature, but if that’s not a big draw for you then our CoL is absolutely insane for such a boring and small place. Paying 2760 per month for a run down shithole 3 bedroom in a shitty neighbourhood fucking sucks and unless you have a degree, you have to work some kind of labour job to make decent money. Most of those are either camp jobs or require a vehicle cause they’re out of range of the public transit.
It is a beautiful place and our summers are short but amazing, but like I said it’s awfully boring if you’re not an outdoorsy person. The winter is also long, dark, and very cold.
Paying 2760 per month for a run down shithole 3 bedroom in a shitty neighbourhood fucking sucks and unless you have a degree, you have to work some kind of labour job to make decent money. Most of those are either camp jobs or require a vehicle cause they’re out of range of the public transit.
over by the yavapai it’s around $1000 per month, but the jobs are still few, far away and pay shit; even the ones that require a degree.
i haven been there since 2014, so maybe it’s worse now.
Obviously monarchy is an outdated concept, but this is a strange hill to die on. The King, or The Crown, is the merely the symbol of Canada’s sovereignty. That’s it. It’s no different than Americans pledging allegiance to the flag. They are not literally pledging allegiance to a piece of cloth anymore than we are literally pledging allegiance to Charles the man. It is just symbology. Neither Charles nor the GG has any real power in Canada and if they ever tried to use their symbolic powers independently of our elected government, it would create an instant Constitutional crisis.
The part I find strange is that it doesn’t seem to have anything to do with municipal affairs. I, for one, want my elected municipal officials to do municipal things, like fix roads and ensure the water treatment plant is working. I don’t particularly want them spending their time fighting an abstract battle about our Constitutional framework. Do the majority of Canadians want to revisit our Constitution and eliminate the Crown so that we are no longer a constitutional monarchy? I’m not saying that is a bad idea in principle, but I lived through the constitutional crises of 1980s and the Quebec separatism of the 1990s and it is rife with unnecessary conflict. It could literally break up the country, and almost did. I do not think that we would be better off as a republic, purely from a practical perspective. The Westminster form of government, for all of its anachronistic monarchical symbols, works well in practice.
I really like toronto and would have liked to move there but man this type of thing would have been the hardest part (well obviously there are other hard parts or I would have done it)
What part would have been the hardest? I’m a Canadian and the only time in my life I had to swear an oath was when I went to work in Government. I think I was offered an option to swear on the Bible or to the Queen. Again, the only time in my life it came up and it was kind weird.
Americans swear alliegiance to their flag every day in school. That’s weird.
yeah the pledge was wierd but it was actually not that often and even by upper grade school your going to get a lot of clowning around it so im not sure if they gave up all over or just after a certain grade. Honestly its just the technical monarchy part. I might misunderstand but I thought some representative of the monarch could dissolve parliment and make and break treaties and such.
The constitutional monarchy is just a leftover remnant and not relevant to daily lift. The Governor General (the King/Queen’s representative) does have the power to dissolve and create governments but it’s really just symbolic. If they were ever to use that power against the wishes of the electorate, that power would probably get taken away really quickly.
King Charles hasn’t even visted Canada since he became king. That’s how much the monarchy means to us too in Canada. Symbolic, but stay away.
Yeah but you know how they say its the unenforced laws that are the most dangerous. I mean look at the republicans down here. they would love shit like that in the books to play with.
I’ve become a Canadian citizen fairly recently, and the first time I have ever encountered anything related to the King since the past eight years I’ve been living here was during the Citizenship Oath. Which was a fun little ceremony.
You don’t even have to become a citizen to live in Toronto. Instead I’d just simply not live in Toronto because it’s a shit place, not because of some irrelevancy.
oh its not what held me back. its just hard. by the time I realized how much toronto was like chicago as far as its infrastructure (transit, the lake, similar weather, skline, parks, etc) I was already established and had a wife and real estate. Its just to much to risk so much.
Thats hard to say. its been so swingy but from most of what I have looked at they have been comprable. Im not sure though if the greater toronto region has as many affordable options. For example I live in a burb just outside the city in a modest condo but im still near (the end of) a rapid transit line.
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Have you seen king charles??? I mean if he were standing right in front of me I am certain I would laugh. He is a hapless clown.
Good on them. I would refuse it too. Personally I find it abhorrent that we as a society still allow this one person to be a king just because he was born into the magic family.
We already have a Canadian Governor General doing the actual job, why not just formalize it and do away eyes the crown.
The Governor General is appointed by the Crown as its representative, technically. You can’t have the former without the latter.
We could move to having an elected President as head of state as well as a Prime Minister who tends to the day-to-day business of government, as some other countries like France do, but it wouldn’t really change much of anything . . . except adding the trouble and expense of another federal election. Seems like a lot of work for nothing to me.
Then again, I have no Indigenous ancestry and no bad history with the Crown, and I can see why people in the Yukon might feel differently about it.
I think we could. In practice they are chosen by the Prime Minister, so we could formalize this practice locally without the crown, but without resorting to an unnecessary election.
Why not have the Prime Minister appoint the President, who must be confirmed by parliament, and keep the role of the President to be mostly ceremonial. Not much changes from today except the removal of the Crown.
The oath of allegiance can be changed to that of a republic which represents all humans in Canada.
I believe that would require the federal government to amend the constitution which is no simple feat. All premiers would have to agree to the changes which opens a whole can of worms since Quebec never formally signed on the original constitution, and the other premiers would very likely demand other changes be made as well to suit their own political agenda.
Then the provinces would need to have their own legislative amendments made to recognize the changes in both the constitution, which would also take time to pass as well.
If there is a change in government on either the federal or provincial level, and the party has a vested interest to undo those changes, all that progress gets flushed down the drain.
Yes absolutely, any change to the monarchy needs a constitutional amendment, which basically means “not gonna happen” because of everything you outlined, unless there’s a massive shift in opinion among Canadians.
The best short term outcome here is probably for the Canadian government and courts to just conveniently ignore or bend some rules… let these people swear an oath of allegiance to the constitution and let a judge do some hand wavy legal magic and say “hmm, close enough”.
Charles is nothing but a normal dude…I respect these people for not blindly saying sole crap that nobody agrees with
Royalty need not exist in this world anymore
I like to think of it like a zoo exhibit, come and see the orangutans. The royals have no real power in our society, and I’m sure every party has legislation prepped to abolish the monarchy if they ever try anything other than what they’re told. So long as they keep bringing in more money than it costs to feed em I can see keeping them around.
That being said we should start working on removing them from government ceremonies like this. Why not swear to the people, or on the charter or something.
The problem is they don’t need legislation, they need a constitutional amendment which is a pretty high bar to pass…
Never get there if we don’t start!
Agree with you there!
I would love to see the monarchy abolished.
I think it’s easier for Britain to remove the king then Canada.
So what happens when the byelection is called and the same people are elected and refuse to pledge allegiance? Another countdown timer?
It is a tricky situation where two governance structures collide. We really need to modify the constitution such that the GG replaces the Crown in all matters of state. They do all the work already anyway.
I mean for these kind of nut jobs I can’t imagine pledging to the GG is actually significantly better than the Crown. I say that because I’m also such a nut job, at least in principle.
For anyone who has been to the Yukon Territory and gazed upon its majesty, King Charles can get fucked. That province may as well be a wild horse. Even Alaska is a giant let-down by comparison.
Born and raised here. It’s nice if you love the outdoors and nature, but if that’s not a big draw for you then our CoL is absolutely insane for such a boring and small place. Paying 2760 per month for a run down shithole 3 bedroom in a shitty neighbourhood fucking sucks and unless you have a degree, you have to work some kind of labour job to make decent money. Most of those are either camp jobs or require a vehicle cause they’re out of range of the public transit.
It is a beautiful place and our summers are short but amazing, but like I said it’s awfully boring if you’re not an outdoorsy person. The winter is also long, dark, and very cold.
over by the yavapai it’s around $1000 per month, but the jobs are still few, far away and pay shit; even the ones that require a degree.
i haven been there since 2014, so maybe it’s worse now.
Why did you call it a territory, then call Yukon a province?
Brain fart, I guess.
It’s a territory because it doesn’t have the same rights as a province.
Obviously monarchy is an outdated concept, but this is a strange hill to die on. The King, or The Crown, is the merely the symbol of Canada’s sovereignty. That’s it. It’s no different than Americans pledging allegiance to the flag. They are not literally pledging allegiance to a piece of cloth anymore than we are literally pledging allegiance to Charles the man. It is just symbology. Neither Charles nor the GG has any real power in Canada and if they ever tried to use their symbolic powers independently of our elected government, it would create an instant Constitutional crisis.
Sounds like not such a strange hill tbh
The part I find strange is that it doesn’t seem to have anything to do with municipal affairs. I, for one, want my elected municipal officials to do municipal things, like fix roads and ensure the water treatment plant is working. I don’t particularly want them spending their time fighting an abstract battle about our Constitutional framework. Do the majority of Canadians want to revisit our Constitution and eliminate the Crown so that we are no longer a constitutional monarchy? I’m not saying that is a bad idea in principle, but I lived through the constitutional crises of 1980s and the Quebec separatism of the 1990s and it is rife with unnecessary conflict. It could literally break up the country, and almost did. I do not think that we would be better off as a republic, purely from a practical perspective. The Westminster form of government, for all of its anachronistic monarchical symbols, works well in practice.
couldn’t have said it any better myself
Can we start calling him “Mr. Sausage fingers”?
I really like toronto and would have liked to move there but man this type of thing would have been the hardest part (well obviously there are other hard parts or I would have done it)
What part would have been the hardest? I’m a Canadian and the only time in my life I had to swear an oath was when I went to work in Government. I think I was offered an option to swear on the Bible or to the Queen. Again, the only time in my life it came up and it was kind weird.
Americans swear alliegiance to their flag every day in school. That’s weird.
yeah the pledge was wierd but it was actually not that often and even by upper grade school your going to get a lot of clowning around it so im not sure if they gave up all over or just after a certain grade. Honestly its just the technical monarchy part. I might misunderstand but I thought some representative of the monarch could dissolve parliment and make and break treaties and such.
The constitutional monarchy is just a leftover remnant and not relevant to daily lift. The Governor General (the King/Queen’s representative) does have the power to dissolve and create governments but it’s really just symbolic. If they were ever to use that power against the wishes of the electorate, that power would probably get taken away really quickly.
King Charles hasn’t even visted Canada since he became king. That’s how much the monarchy means to us too in Canada. Symbolic, but stay away.
Yeah but you know how they say its the unenforced laws that are the most dangerous. I mean look at the republicans down here. they would love shit like that in the books to play with.
I’ve become a Canadian citizen fairly recently, and the first time I have ever encountered anything related to the King since the past eight years I’ve been living here was during the Citizenship Oath. Which was a fun little ceremony.
You don’t even have to become a citizen to live in Toronto. Instead I’d just simply not live in Toronto because it’s a shit place, not because of some irrelevancy.
So don’t let Charles hold you back!
oh its not what held me back. its just hard. by the time I realized how much toronto was like chicago as far as its infrastructure (transit, the lake, similar weather, skline, parks, etc) I was already established and had a wife and real estate. Its just to much to risk so much.
yeah, I would think the cost of living would have been a bigger concern.
Thats hard to say. its been so swingy but from most of what I have looked at they have been comprable. Im not sure though if the greater toronto region has as many affordable options. For example I live in a burb just outside the city in a modest condo but im still near (the end of) a rapid transit line.