Most people have extremely weird ideas of what’s considered piracy and what isn’t. Downloading a video game rom is piracy, but if you pay money to some Chinese retailer for an SD card containing the roms, that’s somehow not piracy. Exploiting the free trial on a streaming site by using prepaid visa cards is somehow not piracy either. Torrenting an album is piracy, but listening to a bootleg on YouTube isn’t.
YouTube noticed this at some point and is now happy to let everyone know how much pirated music is available on their site. One of their main points for shilling YouTube premium is how their music catalogue is way better than Spotify. Of course the piracy site has more. That’s always how it works. Spotify actually has to license the music on their platform and is subject to copyright law. They can’t just get the Neil Young discography from soulseek one day and wait until his estate notices, facing no repercussions whatsoever aside from agreeing to a takedown request. Imagine if Pirate Bay or Napster were considered completely above-board businesses just because they took down torrents if explicitly requested by the copyright holders.
Not that I’m complaining especially when a lot of the music on youtube isn’t publicly accessible anywhere else. It’s just been extremely strange to see this go from an “open secret” to something they’re shouting from the rooftops and face no repercussions for. In the future I want everything to be like that and I’d rather keep youtube how it is than see them get the punishment that by all rights they should be getting. It’s just so strange that this is the position things have ended up in.
Note: The following text is intentional abuse of the tagginator bot. Fuck you.
ASAP was first used in the US military in the 1950s, and AFAIK originated on usenet and has been used since the 80s. If you are 35 or under, both of these acronyms have existed since before you were born fr fr.
As long as they get to profit from it and not you, then it’s not piracy for them. If a record label wanted to sue Google, they would have a hell of a time.
All I’m aware of is the don’t recommend channel option. I still get stupid fucking channels (like emergency awesome) when I search. Am I missing the option somewhere?
I worked for one of the YouTube founders once, killed me when he explained how they benchmarked all the Copyright detection software available at the time and then picked the worst one to use for their licensing system.
I can’t speak for other countries, but in Italy YouTube pays a lot of money to the Italian copyright holders company for all the potentially pirated videos uploaded by its users.
lol good points and so true. reading this just makes me think of the old quote If the penalty for a crime is a fine, that law only exists for the lower classes. When I think of record labels and big film companies, let’s just say that the first thing that comes to mind isn’t starving artists but coastal elitists getting pissy bc they can’t charge people even more.
A lot of music on YouTube is fully licensed and uploaded by the owners or Google themselves. Like VEVO music, for instance.
Google runs a content match algorithm on all uploads to detect music and movies. If you upload more than four seconds of a song, Google will detect it and transfer all monitization of that upload to the rights holder. This is why music documentaries like Trash Theory only have frustratingly short clips of the music they are talking about, and why channels like Techmoan, which documents weird music formats and playback devices, can also only share extremely short clips.
The rights holders are getting any and all money on music uploaded to YouTube, and your entire premise is flawed.
Well, the gigantic pile of low-end audio I ripped using yt-dlp begs to differ. Half a million tracks so far. Perfect for my OpenSwim headphones. Tiny mp3s to maximize my 4GB of storage, and shit quality to match what I’m getting from bone conductors (which are, for no compelling reason, compatible with FLAC).
I swim a lot, and have a lot of free disk space, so I promise this makes sense.
His logic chain may have been flawed for his argument, but his premise is not wrong. YouTube providing a distribution platform for any type of music video means that content holders are putting music on there and suffering the same rules as anyone else. To the best of my knowledge, Google does not pay any additional license fees to content owners should they elect to upload a music video to the platform. The owner makes ad revenue just like all other creators. This effectively circumvents the costly licensing agreements that the likes of Spotify and Pandora have to enter into.
I would also add that google very much understands the implications of streaming music.
This is speculated to be why you can’t get Youtube Premium without Youtube Music (in most countries?). Because all the license holders would lose their minds if they weren’t getting a cut (and apparently the ad revenue from music videos isn’t enough).
Do they still do takedowns for videos based on that content IDing if the video isn’t even monetized in the first place?
Like, I know youtubers who try to make money hate this, but what about youtubers who aren’t in it for the money but just want to throw content on the platform? Can stuff like AMVs actually stay up?
Because, frankly, I’ve found that it’s been pretty easy to dodge YouTube ads, by means of uBlock Origin.
If I recall correctly, the copyright holders can decide what they want to happen automatically.
The automatic options are something like:
Disable all ads.
Enable ads (if disabled) and take all (?) money.
Mute/remove the infringing content.
They can also do stuff like issue copyright strikes but I believe that those have to be done manually since they can be so destructive to creators.
Tom Scott made a really good video about how copyright works in general and how it works on YouTube, I highly recommend it. https://youtu.be/1Jwo5qc78QU
And there are notorious “blockers” - publishers and bands who copyright strike and remove all third party videos using their music. Reference Rick Beatos various videos and rants on this topic.
That’s the thing that drives me fucking nuts. Use 10 seconds of a song in your 10 minute video, and they get all the money for your work. They should get whatever the percent of your video is that their song occupies at best. If you’re talking/acting over top of their music, then you’re splitting that percentage in half.
I don’t know if they’re still there but it used to be if you looked at the description of any officially uploaded music on youtube, there’d be a laundry list of music rights groups for like a dozen countries/areas
Google doesn’t just get blanket rights to stream a song, they have to license the rights to play that particular song separately for each individual country where they want to stream it
There are a ton that have weird fucking usernames. I was confused at first why my Bluetooth was showing BobByJimSmith4345 as the “artist” after telling it to play a song, but yeah they’ll pretty much just look whatever up by name from YouTube and play it.
Probably, but at least with genres like vocaloid, you’ll find plenty of people taking songs/videos from sites like Bilibili or Niconico and they’ll either just straight up upload the video or will instead just slap on subtitles and upload without consent. There’s also a similar phenomenon with anime music as well, but that’s usually for just the music.
The music on YouTube isn’t any more piracy than unblocked Spotify. YouTube’s “official” music uploads (these that are a square with a blurred background behind the square) are acquired by paying DistroKid or record labels. Unofficial uploaders usually aren’t monetized, either bc they didn’t enable it、are niche、or got ContentID’d by YouTube. Those few that are monetized(e.g. Si𝚕vaGunner and Gi𝚕vaSunner (i.e. not Si𝙸vaGunner or Gi𝙸vaSunner)) usually get DMCA’d eventually.
Downloading from YouTube is piracy though, though like OP says some don’t think so for some reason.
And many non-official uploads are let stay because somebody sent them a dmca and they chose to keep the video up but let monetization pay out to the org that copyright claimed the content. So the ancient “song name (hd)” video from cheeselicker9000 isn’t official but the record label likely gets paid for any ad revenue they make from it. Most labels just strike the non official stuff and upload their own nowadays though. I know when I did some youtube that was one of the options for a response, just letting the claimant take ad revenue and manage monetization.
Downloading from youtube is piracy? How? If it was like a Youtube Red show, sure, but the normal videos everyone can see for free?
For me piracy begins with aquiring things or features which usually cost money to get whilst also taking into account if its obvious a thing should cost money in such an environment (thats also how our piracy laws are worded here).
So our piracy laws also classify things as piracy if it was obvious the deal was too good to be true like Windows for 2$ on eBay or chinese ROM cards for 5$ with hundreds of games.
Videos on youtube, including music, are a normal occurrence. A full blockbuster movie is usually not.
If it would be hard to do and having to bypass DRM yes, but its actually similar to what the player already does.
A court already ruled here that downloading youtube videos does not break the piracy laws by providing own means of downloading and saving the unprotected data.
Of course that does not include allowing the download feature of the client itself.
Me. We have a living breathing example of why public file sharing is a good thing that exposes music to new audiences and I want people to recognize that.
Not if people would wake up and just use freaking Firefox which Google has not (that great of) control over. I feel it’s such a simple solution but somehow the Internet users collectively seem to have decided that they’d rather enjoy ads.
You are not logged in. However you can subscribe from another Fediverse account, for example Lemmy or Mastodon. To do this, paste the following into the search field of your instance: !piracy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
⚓ Dedicated to the discussion of digital piracy, including ethical problems and legal advancements.
Wtf is the tagginator bot?
Not sure, but I think its purpose is to get get these posts appear in meta search engine results (SEO).
AFAIK it’s for discovery on Mastodon via hashtag.
afaik… as far as i know… hm…
afaik these acronyms are getting more insane asap fr fr
ASAP was first used in the US military in the 1950s, and AFAIK originated on usenet and has been used since the 80s. If you are 35 or under, both of these acronyms have existed since before you were born fr fr.
AFAIK is a very established and widely recognized acronym with decades of history. Just saying.
IYKYK W/E IG. SMH.
Thats the spirit!
they have a deal with Vevo i think
As long as they get to profit from it and not you, then it’s not piracy for them. If a record label wanted to sue Google, they would have a hell of a time.
YouTube and Spotify are paying license fees to be allowed to play music on their platform.
I wanna know who is paying YouTube to allow those stupid fake movies trailers. I wish YouTube had a block channel option.
There is a block channel option. I use it all the time.
All I’m aware of is the don’t recommend channel option. I still get stupid fucking channels (like emergency awesome) when I search. Am I missing the option somewhere?
I worked for one of the YouTube founders once, killed me when he explained how they benchmarked all the Copyright detection software available at the time and then picked the worst one to use for their licensing system.
That’s fucking genius. I love it.
Is this real?
They posted it on the Internet, so it has to be.
I only use the best lie detectors
Tagline for Lemmy (every social media in existence)
You think someone would just do that? Just go on the internet and lie?
Well, this is certainly one of the takes of all time.
I can’t speak for other countries, but in Italy YouTube pays a lot of money to the Italian copyright holders company for all the potentially pirated videos uploaded by its users.
lol good points and so true. reading this just makes me think of the old quote If the penalty for a crime is a fine, that law only exists for the lower classes. When I think of record labels and big film companies, let’s just say that the first thing that comes to mind isn’t starving artists but coastal elitists getting pissy bc they can’t charge people even more.
You’re missing some key facts:
The rights holders are getting any and all money on music uploaded to YouTube, and your entire premise is flawed.
Well, the gigantic pile of low-end audio I ripped using yt-dlp begs to differ. Half a million tracks so far. Perfect for my OpenSwim headphones. Tiny mp3s to maximize my 4GB of storage, and shit quality to match what I’m getting from bone conductors (which are, for no compelling reason, compatible with FLAC).
I swim a lot, and have a lot of free disk space, so I promise this makes sense.
His logic chain may have been flawed for his argument, but his premise is not wrong. YouTube providing a distribution platform for any type of music video means that content holders are putting music on there and suffering the same rules as anyone else. To the best of my knowledge, Google does not pay any additional license fees to content owners should they elect to upload a music video to the platform. The owner makes ad revenue just like all other creators. This effectively circumvents the costly licensing agreements that the likes of Spotify and Pandora have to enter into.
I would also add that google very much understands the implications of streaming music.
This is speculated to be why you can’t get Youtube Premium without Youtube Music (in most countries?). Because all the license holders would lose their minds if they weren’t getting a cut (and apparently the ad revenue from music videos isn’t enough).
Do they still do takedowns for videos based on that content IDing if the video isn’t even monetized in the first place?
Like, I know youtubers who try to make money hate this, but what about youtubers who aren’t in it for the money but just want to throw content on the platform? Can stuff like AMVs actually stay up?
Because, frankly, I’ve found that it’s been pretty easy to dodge YouTube ads, by means of uBlock Origin.
They don’t take it down often. But non-monetized videos will get set as monetized, ads will be added, and the profits go to the Copyright holder.
If I recall correctly, the copyright holders can decide what they want to happen automatically.
The automatic options are something like:
They can also do stuff like issue copyright strikes but I believe that those have to be done manually since they can be so destructive to creators.
Tom Scott made a really good video about how copyright works in general and how it works on YouTube, I highly recommend it. https://youtu.be/1Jwo5qc78QU
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://piped.video/1Jwo5qc78QU
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
And there are notorious “blockers” - publishers and bands who copyright strike and remove all third party videos using their music. Reference Rick Beatos various videos and rants on this topic.
That’s the thing that drives me fucking nuts. Use 10 seconds of a song in your 10 minute video, and they get all the money for your work. They should get whatever the percent of your video is that their song occupies at best. If you’re talking/acting over top of their music, then you’re splitting that percentage in half.
I don’t know if they’re still there but it used to be if you looked at the description of any officially uploaded music on youtube, there’d be a laundry list of music rights groups for like a dozen countries/areas
Google doesn’t just get blanket rights to stream a song, they have to license the rights to play that particular song separately for each individual country where they want to stream it
Paying money is technically bootlegging, which I would argue is massively worse than piracy. But only because piracy is whatever.
No idea if you have ever uploaded to youtube but I can’t upload audio of my dick slapping my ankle without Disney or universal claiming royalties.
Tbf Walt Disney himself invented the sound of a dick slapping an ankle
It was the last thing he did before being frozen
Let it go
Lets go of dick
Dick slaps ankle
Aren’t most songs on YouTube uploaded by the artists themselves?
There are a ton that have weird fucking usernames. I was confused at first why my Bluetooth was showing BobByJimSmith4345 as the “artist” after telling it to play a song, but yeah they’ll pretty much just look whatever up by name from YouTube and play it.
Probably, but at least with genres like vocaloid, you’ll find plenty of people taking songs/videos from sites like Bilibili or Niconico and they’ll either just straight up upload the video or will instead just slap on subtitles and upload without consent. There’s also a similar phenomenon with anime music as well, but that’s usually for just the music.
If the original artist reports the pirated song, YouTube will most likely remove it.
If no one reports it, then YouTube is going to keep it.
No, certainly not most. Some, for sure, but tons of albums are uploaded by some random dude.
The music on YouTube isn’t any more piracy than unblocked Spotify. YouTube’s “official” music uploads (these that are a square with a blurred background behind the square) are acquired by paying DistroKid or record labels. Unofficial uploaders usually aren’t monetized, either bc they didn’t enable it、are niche、or got ContentID’d by YouTube. Those few that are monetized(e.g. Si𝚕vaGunner and Gi𝚕vaSunner (i.e. not Si𝙸vaGunner or Gi𝙸vaSunner)) usually get DMCA’d eventually.
Downloading from YouTube is piracy though, though like OP says some don’t think so for some reason.
And many non-official uploads are let stay because somebody sent them a dmca and they chose to keep the video up but let monetization pay out to the org that copyright claimed the content. So the ancient “song name (hd)” video from cheeselicker9000 isn’t official but the record label likely gets paid for any ad revenue they make from it. Most labels just strike the non official stuff and upload their own nowadays though. I know when I did some youtube that was one of the options for a response, just letting the claimant take ad revenue and manage monetization.
Yeah, that’s what I meant by “got ContentID’d”.
Ah gotcha, I didn’t know the term for that :)
Why are you using Chinese enumeration commas?
i.e. “、” instead of “,”
to separate the list from the regular comma
that’s what ‘-’ is for
how is the hyphen for that
Downloading from youtube is piracy? How? If it was like a Youtube Red show, sure, but the normal videos everyone can see for free?
For me piracy begins with aquiring things or features which usually cost money to get whilst also taking into account if its obvious a thing should cost money in such an environment (thats also how our piracy laws are worded here).
So our piracy laws also classify things as piracy if it was obvious the deal was too good to be true like Windows for 2$ on eBay or chinese ROM cards for 5$ with hundreds of games.
Videos on youtube, including music, are a normal occurrence. A full blockbuster movie is usually not.
YouTube’s and Spotify’s download features usually cost money
If it would be hard to do and having to bypass DRM yes, but its actually similar to what the player already does.
A court already ruled here that downloading youtube videos does not break the piracy laws by providing own means of downloading and saving the unprotected data.
Of course that does not include allowing the download feature of the client itself.
Who cares? Google has a legal team for such things, i don’t.
Me. We have a living breathing example of why public file sharing is a good thing that exposes music to new audiences and I want people to recognize that.
I like your style! Keep it up! We live in a world where people are increasingly choosing to live in delusion.
its a resource like any other. use it, abuse it… while you can. with the impending browser restrictions the world might change a bit. a tiny bit.
Not if people would wake up and just use freaking Firefox which Google has not (that great of) control over. I feel it’s such a simple solution but somehow the Internet users collectively seem to have decided that they’d rather enjoy ads.