We need to go back to pre-discord and bring back forums man. Don’t get me wrong, discord has its uses, all my friends use it, but discord killing forums and websites was really bad for the internet as a whole. Like look at dolphin, made before discord, it has its own website, its own forums. Hopefully if Nintendo does ever come after dolphin they’ll at least be able to keep the website and forums up.
I should add that it wasn’t the norm back then either.
What’s kind of funny is that all of the debates around these systems are exactly the same today as back then, like for example that you should use the voting system to reward quality comments, not use it as an agree/disagree button.
That’s why you don’t backup on the same provider. You can always backup to the local system with encryption. And they can’t attack the owner in every jurisdiction.
I mean, Suyu already seems to be jumping to a different medium, so it sounds like this situation wouldnt have gone any differently had Suyu had their main support hosted anywhere else. Nintendo would have nuked any of the support locations, and Suyu would then have to jump to a new safe haven
Just wait, they’ll move to Matrix, get legally attacked if they’re hosting in a copyright friendly jurisdiction, and say “fuck it, we’re going to the darkweb”, and Nintendo won’t be able to do shit.
Guess what? This will make them stronger. Suyu’s GitLab repo was already DMCA’d, after that they set up their own Forgejo instance. They also get their website running again (It was down for a few days, I don’t know the reason) and they’re now strong and independent. Moving away from Discord will only increase their independence.
Suyu died though. Right now the only actively maintained Yuzu fork is Sudachi, which is only maintained by a single person.
Apparently there was some drama about the Yuzu devs using code which came from a switch SDK as a basis for emulator code, which kind of poisons the whole codebase.
Apparently there was some drama about the Yuzu devs using code which came from a switch SDK as a basis for emulator code, which kind of poisons the whole codebase.
But if this was in Yuzu, it’s also present in every other fork, right? Also, was this a leaked Nintendo SDK or something 3rd-party?
The devs said so. Check r/Suyu, that seems to be where a majority of the updates are being posted. I think there was a link to a pastebin post somewhere there as well.
The SDK mentioned was first party, presumably leaked but I’m not completely sure. And yes, that means it would be present in every other fork as well.
Edit: here are some of the links I’m talking about:
I don’t know how much of this evidence is real but if any of it is they’re going to have a much harder time finding devs willing to contribute to Suyu, even if development does continue.
I don’t understand using Discord for documentation or official dev communications, it just doesn’t sound reliable even if you aren’t chancing running afoul of a billionaire corp or DMCA. Not to mention, there’s now an extra barrier to entry to your project.
User communities and just chatting is fine, but it just makes way more sense to have a forum or other location for documentation and collaboration to happen that can be archived, backed up, and uploaded on other services as well.
If all else fails, just make a .onion site or forum for it
What I find hilarious is that these are just minor hiccups. The emulation scene has existed for a long time and will continue to exist for a long time. None of these recent measures will do anything to stop it as long as the emulator devs aren’t trying to make money off Nintendo IP.
I understand that Lemmy hates Discord, but this is FAR more of Nintendo being an asshat than it is Discord. I’m so far done giving Nintendo my money at this point
edit: I just wanna point out that Corgana posted a response that was straight up false, I called him out on it with proof, he edited his response instead of replying to me to make my response to him look bad, and then when I called him out on that by putting what his original response was in my response, he deleted hos post to try and hide his shame. This user apparently has a history of doing this, and I find this HIGHLY manipulative and scummy, so I’m putting this edit here so that he cant hide his actions by deleting them because I called him out before any damage could be done
Not sure if your sarcasm is towards me or towards someone who’d defend Nintendo, but tbh I’m getting tired of Mega Corps in general (not that I ever really liked them in the first place), so asshats like Nintendo who go above and beyond being a dick because they have the legal team to do so I’m just done giving money to. Indie workers/companies of all fields I’ll try and get money to, but I kind of just want to see the current crop of mega corps sink and not come back
Like, they DO focus pretty well on making fun games. But that isnt enough anymore to overlook how fucking Cyberpunk they act in our modern boring dystopia
If you read the article YES THEY DID, discord was served papers, and Discord acted on it
Nice edit bro. Your original comment said that Nintendo didnt make discord remove anyone, and you COULD have responded to this response instead of editing your original one, which tells me you’re acting in EXTREMELY bad faith
2nd Edit: Lmao, buddy fuckin CRUMPLED when I pointed out his game playing
3rd edit: LMAO it’s one of the mods that ran the startek fed so badly that tenforward was created, ok that makes sense, buddy has a history of editing comments instead of responding
Yes it’s Nintendo. But it wouldn’t be this bad without Discord’s design that emphasizes centralization and corporate ownership of user data. Forums can at least be backed up and migrated elsewhere.
Not to mention Discord is not forced to take communities down. There’s lots of stuff like right wing nutjob communities that are still up no issues. Discord is just sucking Nintendo dick, just like the communities that host solely on Discord are sucking Discord cock.
Discord had the heat of litigation forced in their direction, thats the difference between Suyu and the nutjob communities. If some company threatened legal consequences if discord didnt nuke one of the nut job communities, I doubt they would be any less hesitant to nuke said communities than they were for Suyu
Tbf I think a lot of that is just the fault of people starting to use discord in ways it wasnt designed for. It works GREAT as a msn/skype/ventrillo type of program. Its just that people started using it for more than just that, and to my knowledge discord isnt super profitable yet, so I dont blame them for trying to accept any type of use people want to use discord for. Eventually it’ll need to at least break even profit wise.
Discord should be used as an easy way to keep people up to date and host links, like a replacement for Twitter. Not too be the sole source of hosting info. They should still have websites the discord points to.
I mean, my response earlier probably still works for those who’d prefer discord as a support channel to other Foss channels: This is far more of a Nintendo bad moment than it is a Discord bad. I doubt foss alternatives would have the lawyers to fight Nintendo better than Discord can. And while my mind immediately thought of a hydra anology that Foss might have, hasnt the hydra already activated anyways? Suyu is already jumping into different hosting mediums
Mass centralization. Old school forums like phpBB and SMF and vBulletin and new-school forums like self-hosted discourse are also centralized, but by one small user calling the shots, and it’s very clear immediately which forums are well-run. If a forum isn’t well-run with a good community, a ‘competitor’ will quickly pop up that is, and people will go to it. Sure, you have to have some tech skills but there are easy guides for all of it. Discourse is a simple docker image and it’s the best for features and engagement IMO.
Sure you have to sorry about DDoS attacks and staying patched, but you can use OVH or another host with a large infrastructure that had DDoS resistant servers. Or, god forbid, cloudflare.
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We need to go back to pre-discord and bring back forums man. Don’t get me wrong, discord has its uses, all my friends use it, but discord killing forums and websites was really bad for the internet as a whole. Like look at dolphin, made before discord, it has its own website, its own forums. Hopefully if Nintendo does ever come after dolphin they’ll at least be able to keep the website and forums up.
You ppl dont remner how utterly tedious forums were. We hake karma-based systems nowadays, we cam move on
Karma is a net negative for actual community creation and meaningful discussion.
Karma+threaded is better than chronologic imo, why do you think it’s bad?
I’ve used forums that had these things 20 years ago. This isn’t new.
Idk, I wasnt around back then. But most forums I stumble upon have none of that
I should add that it wasn’t the norm back then either.
What’s kind of funny is that all of the debates around these systems are exactly the same today as back then, like for example that you should use the voting system to reward quality comments, not use it as an agree/disagree button.
I mean Nintendo would nuke the forums too.
Their lawyers don’t fuck around. They’re as bad as Disney.
Unless you’re a forum hosted in someplace like the Netherlands or Russia you’re in range for Nintendo’s nukes.
The Netherlands is extremely docile to big business interests.
You’d at least get a chance to migrate if you do daily backups. Not so with Discord.
Thats not what happens with a nuke - they threaten the owner and take everything: backups included.
That’s why you don’t backup on the same provider. You can always backup to the local system with encryption. And they can’t attack the owner in every jurisdiction.
I mean, Suyu already seems to be jumping to a different medium, so it sounds like this situation wouldnt have gone any differently had Suyu had their main support hosted anywhere else. Nintendo would have nuked any of the support locations, and Suyu would then have to jump to a new safe haven
or, you know, lemmy? it’s not that much different from forum software, is browsable and federated
Discord has no uses that isn’t already covered by other options, though. Their biggest feature is publicity.
Just wait, they’ll move to Matrix, get legally attacked if they’re hosting in a copyright friendly jurisdiction, and say “fuck it, we’re going to the darkweb”, and Nintendo won’t be able to do shit.
Anti Commercial-AI license
Guess what? This will make them stronger. Suyu’s GitLab repo was already DMCA’d, after that they set up their own Forgejo instance. They also get their website running again (It was down for a few days, I don’t know the reason) and they’re now strong and independent. Moving away from Discord will only increase their independence.
Suyu died though. Right now the only actively maintained Yuzu fork is Sudachi, which is only maintained by a single person.
Apparently there was some drama about the Yuzu devs using code which came from a switch SDK as a basis for emulator code, which kind of poisons the whole codebase.
What makes you think so?
But if this was in Yuzu, it’s also present in every other fork, right? Also, was this a leaked Nintendo SDK or something 3rd-party?
The devs said so. Check r/Suyu, that seems to be where a majority of the updates are being posted. I think there was a link to a pastebin post somewhere there as well.
The SDK mentioned was first party, presumably leaked but I’m not completely sure. And yes, that means it would be present in every other fork as well.
Edit: here are some of the links I’m talking about:
https://www.reddit.com/r/suyu/s/TqSWDlnsGs
https://pastebin.com/6FYdz9Sr
Edit 2: worth noting that the “founder” (as they call themself) still wants to continue on the project but I believe a majority of the devs left.
Edit 3: I found the archive link from someone on the Yuzu team showing they had access to a leaked switch SDK: https://web.archive.org/web/20210114104638/https://twitter.com/Slashiee_/status/1349557173970341890
I don’t know how much of this evidence is real but if any of it is they’re going to have a much harder time finding devs willing to contribute to Suyu, even if development does continue.
I wonder if the codeberg site is vulnerable to such laws. I think they operate from the EU.
Germany specifically
They’re based in Germany, so it should be fine. But I think they said at some point that they don’t want any trouble with DMCA code.
I don’t understand using Discord for documentation or official dev communications, it just doesn’t sound reliable even if you aren’t chancing running afoul of a billionaire corp or DMCA. Not to mention, there’s now an extra barrier to entry to your project.
User communities and just chatting is fine, but it just makes way more sense to have a forum or other location for documentation and collaboration to happen that can be archived, backed up, and uploaded on other services as well.
If all else fails, just make a .onion site or forum for it
Same. They’re are so many foss options out there, why discord?
What I find hilarious is that these are just minor hiccups. The emulation scene has existed for a long time and will continue to exist for a long time. None of these recent measures will do anything to stop it as long as the emulator devs aren’t trying to make money off Nintendo IP.
I understand that Lemmy hates Discord, but this is FAR more of Nintendo being an asshat than it is Discord. I’m so far done giving Nintendo my money at this point
edit: I just wanna point out that Corgana posted a response that was straight up false, I called him out on it with proof, he edited his response instead of replying to me to make my response to him look bad, and then when I called him out on that by putting what his original response was in my response, he deleted hos post to try and hide his shame. This user apparently has a history of doing this, and I find this HIGHLY manipulative and scummy, so I’m putting this edit here so that he cant hide his actions by deleting them because I called him out before any damage could be done
spoiler
asdfasdfsadfasfasdf
Not sure if your sarcasm is towards me or towards someone who’d defend Nintendo, but tbh I’m getting tired of Mega Corps in general (not that I ever really liked them in the first place), so asshats like Nintendo who go above and beyond being a dick because they have the legal team to do so I’m just done giving money to. Indie workers/companies of all fields I’ll try and get money to, but I kind of just want to see the current crop of mega corps sink and not come back
spoiler
asdfasdfsadfasfasdf
Like, they DO focus pretty well on making fun games. But that isnt enough anymore to overlook how fucking Cyberpunk they act in our modern boring dystopia
spoiler
asdfasdfsadfasfasdf
Welp, at least their price isnt my problem anymore, because I’m done giving them any money
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If you read the article YES THEY DID, discord was served papers, and Discord acted on it
Nice edit bro. Your original comment said that Nintendo didnt make discord remove anyone, and you COULD have responded to this response instead of editing your original one, which tells me you’re acting in EXTREMELY bad faith
2nd Edit: Lmao, buddy fuckin CRUMPLED when I pointed out his game playing
3rd edit: LMAO it’s one of the mods that ran the startek fed so badly that tenforward was created, ok that makes sense, buddy has a history of editing comments instead of responding
Yes it’s Nintendo. But it wouldn’t be this bad without Discord’s design that emphasizes centralization and corporate ownership of user data. Forums can at least be backed up and migrated elsewhere.
Not to mention Discord is not forced to take communities down. There’s lots of stuff like right wing nutjob communities that are still up no issues. Discord is just sucking Nintendo dick, just like the communities that host solely on Discord are sucking Discord cock.
Discord had the heat of litigation forced in their direction, thats the difference between Suyu and the nutjob communities. If some company threatened legal consequences if discord didnt nuke one of the nut job communities, I doubt they would be any less hesitant to nuke said communities than they were for Suyu
Tbf I think a lot of that is just the fault of people starting to use discord in ways it wasnt designed for. It works GREAT as a msn/skype/ventrillo type of program. Its just that people started using it for more than just that, and to my knowledge discord isnt super profitable yet, so I dont blame them for trying to accept any type of use people want to use discord for. Eventually it’ll need to at least break even profit wise.
I’m sure all these companies have similar policy that they can stop hosting your things if they don’t like to
Backup and migrate. Choose only platforms that support it. The only weak point there is the DNS registrar.
Discord should be used as an easy way to keep people up to date and host links, like a replacement for Twitter. Not too be the sole source of hosting info. They should still have websites the discord points to.
Time for them to move over to Matrix.
Ooh! I would like to hear from all those who were fervently vouching for Discord as a support channel for FOSS projects.
Perhaps the same might happen to a web forum or matrix channel. But at least you get an opportunity to backup and migrate.
I mean, my response earlier probably still works for those who’d prefer discord as a support channel to other Foss channels: This is far more of a Nintendo bad moment than it is a Discord bad. I doubt foss alternatives would have the lawyers to fight Nintendo better than Discord can. And while my mind immediately thought of a hydra anology that Foss might have, hasnt the hydra already activated anyways? Suyu is already jumping into different hosting mediums
Centralization = easy censorship.
Mass centralization. Old school forums like phpBB and SMF and vBulletin and new-school forums like self-hosted discourse are also centralized, but by one small user calling the shots, and it’s very clear immediately which forums are well-run. If a forum isn’t well-run with a good community, a ‘competitor’ will quickly pop up that is, and people will go to it. Sure, you have to have some tech skills but there are easy guides for all of it. Discourse is a simple docker image and it’s the best for features and engagement IMO.
Sure you have to sorry about DDoS attacks and staying patched, but you can use OVH or another host with a large infrastructure that had DDoS resistant servers. Or, god forbid, cloudflare.
Maybe they should have picked any of the available chat options that aren’t totally proprietary?
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That happens if a single company controls the community (Reddit, Discord) and its closed source on top of it…
sad. but SO predictable that not having a plan B for this situation is laughable